World War II

[Brian]

9199

I happened to come across this poster from WWII today. I thought it was very interesting because although on the surface it is about venereal disease, it seems to just slightly evoke homosexuality to me. It makes me wonder if:
(a) The powers that be were trying to convey two messages - one warning against VD and the other warning against homosexuality.
OR
(b) The designer/artist was conveying a second message, a hidden one, of his own: "You don't need to risk VD from a hooker, when a buddy will gladly help you out."

Or maybe I imagine too much. Anyway I thought it was interesting, and oddly sexy.

- Drew :paw:

[Long Duck Dong]

there was a standing joke about the navy when I was in the army.... it was based on a village people song, and yeah it could be regarded as a homophobic statement but we did not think of it in terms of anti gay but more the army / navy rivalry but anyways, it went something like

in the navy
you can learn to be a queer
in the navy
you can take it up on the rear
in the navy
you can catch a dreaded disease
in the navy
it'll go up ya ass with ease



some of the old vets that i have talked with, mentioned about shore leave and how for some, getting laid was top of the list, and for others, getting drunk was top of the list... and at times they went hand in hand, with a faint smile and much left to the imagination........

based on the poster, I can only wonder what was being said.... and yes there was the understanding that long stretches at sea made it very hard on horny guys.....and others have argued that in close quarters, nothing could have happened cos of the risk of getting caught... only the sailors themselves know the truth of what went on and its possible that the artist of the poster, may have known more than he let know......

I wonder if we will ever know, seeing as society has changed so much over the years and so has our thinking.......

[Realist]

When I was in the Army ('59-'62) and later in the Air Force. ('63-'67) It was dangerous to be caught in a sexual involvement with another male. There was a little more privacy in the AF, but the same anti gay/bi sentiment prevailed. Still, I know guys did get together....I had two male lovers in the Army and one in the AF.

I and my lovers were extremely cautious and never did anything without planning ahead. Those who were more spontaneous, less cautious and got caught, often suffered the wrath of the UCMJ. Believe me, if you got caught, the punishment was severe! The "guilty" were usually sent to Leavenworth!

I've often wondered about guys stuck in close quarters of ships and especially submarines...what recourse did they have?

I probably would have exploded!

[Gearbox]

Hookers dressed very classy in those days. You could take that one to mothers for wine & crackers.lol

The hooker is HOT, but the sailor on the left looks like a comical virgin, being stopped by a more mature looking sailor. So I expect the poster is an appeal to the more experienced mature sailors to 'police' and warn the newbies.
I doubt that went to plan though.lol

[welickit]

Every guy we know that has been in the navy is either bi or gay, including my brother in law, although my sister doesn't know. The poster will always be an unanswered question...................like wondering if Rosey the Riveter was a dyke.

[fredtyg]

I've heard similar things about the navy, especially about submariners. Not sure just how much is true, though.

[Brian]

...the sailor on the left looks like a comical virgin, being stopped by a more mature looking sailor. So I expect the poster is an appeal to the more experienced mature sailors to 'police' and warn the newbies. And I think that is what is so homo-erotic about it to me. The sailor on the right looks so hunky, and like he is trying to get through to slightly-dim jughead, "I got a better idea dude...".

[dickhand]

I was Army myself . I have heard there was alot of semen in the Navy though ! LOL

[darkeyes]

And I think that is what is so homo-erotic about it to me. The sailor on the right looks so hunky, and like he is trying to get through to slightly-dim jughead, "I got a better idea dude...".
I think droosy woosy, what we have in here is a lil wishful thinkin' on ur part... *laffs*

[12voltman59]

Well--in the move to get rid of DADT in the service, people came forward forward in the media that had served in the military that were gay or bi going back to WWII---there were several gay couples that met back in that war, serving together then becoming partners and have been together ever since---so even though you had to be way on the down low about it all---that sort of thing did go on even in that very repressive age.

I have had a relationship with an older gentleman the past few years who is gay. He was an artillery officer going back to the Vietnam era and after that spent more than 20 years working as one of the top people in what is basically the "PR department" for the United Methodist Church---as such in both organizations---he had many a relationship with other men---both in the highest ranks of both, down through to the lowest levels of the enlisted level in terms of the military, from all branches.

He had a relationship with one man in the Army who was "top brass" and for a time, became the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff--the highest ranking officer in the US military----of course their thing was very much hidden and of course--the big time General was married, had a family and all.

When he worked for the UMC---my friend had a long time affair with one of the top ministers in that religion, with that guy once again----being married.

It got me that since my time in the service--I have come across old ship and station mates that I had served with who I have found on bisexual/gay male sites and both they and I were surprised to learn later that we shared one secret--our response of course is "You too? If only we had known!!"

To me--it is for this alone that made me feel---they might as well end the charade that there are no gay or bi people who serve in the military (and cannot do that effectively and faithfully) so there should have been an end to the official restriction on such service because if they really could prohibit people who are gay/bi from serving---we probably wouldn't be able to fill the ranks with enough qualified people---and its already such a small sliver of the population in this country who have or do serve in the military---something like slightly less than one percent of the population are the ones fighting all the wars we seem to love to get into.

It was no surprise to me that in the first year review about how ending DADT affected the performance of the services----allowing gays/bi to openly serve without sanction did not cause any harm at all to military readiness, operations or morale.

When it comes to cartoons of this sort, it really is amazing that even with stuff that was supposed to reflect the "best of pure manhood" (not being "gay")--it actually did have a degree of homoeroticism. I think back to when I was a kid----there was this one cartoon character that was a boy whose character only dressed in what was basically a pair of undies---it aroused a degree of sexual desire in me for his character even being a young boy myself, something that I of course did not understand then--but didn't think it was "wrong" or "unnatural." In terms I would describe it now--I thought his character was attractive and "hot." I would play by myself in my room, wearing my "tightie whities" pretending to be that character, imagining that I was being held down by some "bad guy" who had caught me, not quite appreciating the finer points of such a thing.

It is funny---one time a year or so ago when chatting on here---a few of us got into discussing the underlying sexual aspects of superheros and I started to talk about this character---I cannot recall the name of the character and the name of the comic books he appeared in---as I recall it was a secondary strip that appeared in some other comic series--but one other guy my age said he recalled that character too--and he too said that he now realizes that the character aroused sexual feelings for him as well.

I am sure that those who came up with that cartoon didn't intend that young boys would feel that way about a superhero---but then again---maybe they did it on the sly and knew full well what they were doing!

I don't have any doubt now that there really was a strong sexual undertone to the whole superhero comic universe.

[Gearbox]

And I think that is what is so homo-erotic about it to me. The sailor on the right looks so hunky, and like he is trying to get through to slightly-dim jughead, "I got a better idea dude...".
Oh I get you now. Took me a while, but I getcha!;)

[pepperjack]

I've known three navy vets who confessed to me of their male/male encounters while serving, another, a co-worker I was suspicious of because of 'vibes,' and a current co-worker I'm even more suspicious of because of same 'vibes.' Btw....studly sailor on the right appears to have a noticeable bulge in his pants....or is that my imagination?

[Prince of Thieves]

I think it's about VD, and any reference to homosexuality (pro or anti) doesn't really come through to me.

[darkeyes]

I've known three navy vets who confessed to me of their male/male encounters while serving, another, a co-worker I was suspicious of because of 'vibes,' and a current co-worker I'm even more suspicious of because of same 'vibes.' Btw....studly sailor on the right appears to have a noticeable bulge in his pants....or is that my imagination?
He does Pepper... but if ''is knob is wer that lump is 'e wos a ver funny guy anatomically speakin'.. or the artist hadn't a clue bout the human anatomy...

...very naive in the 1940s... me Auntie Jean thought babbas just appeared out of thin air (tbh not 2 sure that she still does..)... not even a stork or gooseberry bush involved... an' certainly not a knob.. even me Gran thought unless u believed in God u wouldn't ever get preggers.... God knows wot she wud think bout now.. an' she h8ed me dad's dad's bro... a navy man... he had 2 b queer cos he opted to join the Navy b4 he got called up an every 1 knows men in navy are always banging away at each others botties wile at sea...ahhh rum sodomy and the lash.... bad sailor boys...how did the Brits ever build an Empire wiv such limp wristed weirdos in 'er navy??? This wos confirmed for her by rumours that Mountbatten liked a bit of mano y mano rumpy.. not the King tho... Kings don't do that sort of thing and they have 2 join the navy cos it's expected and to lead by example... wen I raised issue of Edward II of England and Jamie Saxt she refused to believe it of the first and sed she expected nowt else of the second.. he wasn't English after all... then she belted me face for cheek and talking filth an' sent me to me room... 12 yo girls wer not meant to discuss or know such things... o happy days...

[csrakate]

I think droosy woosy, what we have in here is a lil wishful thinkin' on ur part... *laffs*

I have to agree with Fran on this one....though there is nothing wrong with wishful thinking LOL! I think it is simply another one of these:http://i648.photobucket.com/albums/uu205/csrakate1/dirtygirl.jpg

[DuckiesDarling]

Well as someone who's brother in law was in the modern Navy... I have to say that poster was all about keeping the sailors from the prostitutes and the diseases they might carry than about anything to do with homoeroticism. Sorry, Drew, guess it was wishful thinking on your part as has been pointed out.

[darkeyes]

..and if I may say so Droosy Woosy, big tuff macho sailor boy tellin' dim witted jughead he has better idea is maybe not a message bi peeps wish to get over now is it:eek2:? Hmmmm? ;)

[welickit]

The original of this poster is in the library of congress. I thought it might be fun to research the artist........artist is listed as unknown. The explanation given matches DD's last post above.

[12voltman59]

I am sure that on the one hand--as people have been saying---the poster was on the surface all about trying to prevent sailors from getting VD---its just that for some who served---namely those who were gay/bi---the poster did have the sort of unintended aspect to it that Drew talked about--just like I think there is a very strong but surely unintended tone of "homo eroticism" present in super-hero comic books.

[jamieknyc]

"Pickups and good time girls" refers to young women who liked picking up soldiers and sailors on their way overseas, not prostitutes. There were thousands of them in New York during the war.

[void()]

Well as someone who's brother in law was in the modern Navy... I have to say that poster was all about keeping the sailors from the prostitutes and the diseases they might carry than about anything to do with homoeroticism. Sorry, Drew, guess it was wishful thinking on your part as has been pointed out.

Service branches also use the U.S.O and other organizations and keep 'fun buses' on hand. These fun buses are loaded with safe gals who have to get tested. Also, 'television watching' is frowned upon for first dates, normally after a half dozen or so dates you might consider watching television with one of gals from a fun bus.