Gay guys advise me not to date guys

[sodorukim]

Hi all,

I've had this question for quite some time and would appreciate your input.

I'm a self-identified bisexual guy but I've only dated girls before. It's not like I've never been close to guys but whether they're openly bisexual or not, they eventually started dating girls again. Then when I talked to my gay friends, they said if I had a choice, I should date girls instead of guys because of their family problems with their sexuality.

I understand why they think leading a straight life would be easier, but the truth is I would really like to try dating a guy for real if given the chance and right person. Do you guys think that's worth a try? I'm asking because I don't feel comfortable with the idea of me bottoming, but the guys I got intimate with are more masculine than me. My friends said sex is more important in a homosexual relationship and I've seen break-ups because of poor sex. I just wonder if things are likely to fall apart because of my reluctance.

Please kindly share your experience/advice. Thanks!

[cbb83]

If you find a connection with someone, be it man, woman, trans, etc, and you find you love them - be with them. That's my opinion anyway. Regarding the sex being more important in gay relationships bit: not really, that really depends on whether or not you and your partner are just looking for a sexual fling or if you actually love each other. Sometimes younger people (regardless of orientation) are a bit promiscuous and self-centered while they explore their sexuality, and often have many failed relationships because they're just traipsing from experience to experience. Some settle down, some don't. If you're the type that wants a settled relationship, be up front about that. It will scare away most of the unsettled types and save you some heartache; although it may leave you temporarily frustrated until you find someone along your lines.

[Realist]

This strikes home with me as I once had a male Japanese lover, who's family and friends were vehemently against gay, or bisexual relationships.

It has always been difficult for me to advise others, because we each have such different interests, motivations, and desires.

As one who has been attracted to both genders since my earliest memory, I have only had one issue. That was to find someone who has the same feelings and needs I do.

Since I've mostly lived in a society that was militantly against any kind of same-gender intimacy, (which you seem to have addressed) I had to conduct some of my relationships in strict privacy.

Your choice is, as I see it, is to have your heterosexual relationships where ever and when ever you wish. However, because of prevailing attitudes toward bisexuals, being secretive and cautious with your male lover in private, may be the only choice you have.

Good luck with what ever you choose to do!

[Gearbox]

Just give it a try, no matter what anybody says! It's always best to learn from experience IMO. Not that I've learned very much from it though.:rolleyes:
In MY experience of dating gay blokes, there is a big culture gap and am on a different wavelength to theirs.
When the persecution dies down and they realise that you are actually bisexual, things can go to drama or to apathy making that different wavelength way too emphasised. That happens around the 4 week mark usually.lol
That is MY experience though, and it won't necessarily be yours.....hopefully. The 'right man' is the crux of it and not ALL gay men are the 'wrong man'.:)

Bottoming just to please a partner is NOT a good idea! As a top, I set that record straight from the outset. If your'e not sexually compatible, that's just tough luck!
But I don't know why you think that masculine men would want to top you instead of bottoming. Masculinity is no indicator of that preference, so you may be in luck.

Give it a go! Good luck.:)

[darkeyes]

Wudnt worry bout it.. gay girls tell me same thing....:cutelaugh

[elian]

I'm asking because I don't feel comfortable with the idea of me bottoming, but the guys I got intimate with are more masculine than me. My friends said sex is more important in a homosexual relationship and I've seen break-ups because of poor sex. I just wonder if things are likely to fall apart because of my reluctance. Please kindly share your experience/advice. Thanks! Not every person is interested in full-on anal sex, there are other things you can do that are also pleasurable. Whether you are dominate or submissive may be another matter. Then again who really has the power in oral sex? Is it the man who is receiving or the man who is giving? Who has the power in frottage? I find that I often start out submissive and as I become more or less aroused by certain situations (and the needs of my partner) things change..it can be fun not quite knowing who is "in charge" .. A person can still be discreet and managouous if they desire to do so.. Hiding such an integral part of who you are is not always pleasant, but it is possible.

[CurEUs_Male]

the initial statements from your gay friends seem to be along the line that bisexuals have a choice to be gay or straight. Something is wrong with that attitude, and it seems prevelent with both the monosexual camps. It goes with bi's don't exist. Needless to say to those here, we do, and as such, you will likely find more happiness in being with other bisexuals over gay men and straight women (assuming you are being honest with them about other partners).

The other half if this is more to do with your personal limits. If you are looking for oral only play with a BF, then you need to be up front with that. I see a lit of ads that say oral only, and some that are all about other non-anal activities. It is a negotiation. Yes, you may end up not having a terrific guy as a sexual partner because his limits are further down the list than yours, and he feels he need to have that activity, but you can still make new close friends along the way. What ever your interest, there is someone else out there that will match it, just be upfront. And if you do find a guy that just limits the same things, consider maintaining that along with some poly options for the female desires. Upfront, honest discussions will make a huge difference.

Al

[sodorukim]

If you find a connection with someone, be it man, woman, trans, etc, and you find you love them - be with them. That's my opinion anyway. Regarding the sex being more important in gay relationships bit: not really, that really depends on whether or not you and your partner are just looking for a sexual fling or if you actually love each other. Sometimes younger people (regardless of orientation) are a bit promiscuous and self-centered while they explore their sexuality, and often have many failed relationships because they're just traipsing from experience to experience. Some settle down, some don't. If you're the type that wants a settled relationship, be up front about that. It will scare away most of the unsettled types and save you some heartache; although it may leave you temporarily frustrated until you find someone along your lines.

While I pursued my exes actively, I never did the same with guys. I don't know why there's such a difference, and right now I'm focusing on my career and study at the same time so I don't plan on dating anytime soon. But I'd like to think this through during this time so I will know for sure what I want when someone comes along. And being upfront is a great idea. Thanks!

[sodorukim]

This strikes home with me as I once had a male Japanese lover, who's family and friends were vehemently against gay, or bisexual relationships.

It has always been difficult for me to advise others, because we each have such different interests, motivations, and desires.

As one who has been attracted to both genders since my earliest memory, I have only had one issue. That was to find someone who has the same feelings and needs I do.

Since I've mostly lived in a 2society that was militantly against any kind of same-gender intimacy, (which you seem to have addressed) I had to conduct some of my relationships in strict privacy.

Your choice is, as I see it, is to have your heterosexual relationships where ever and when ever you wish. However, because of prevailing attitudes toward bisexuals, being secretive and cautious with your male lover in private, may be the only choice you have.

Good luck with what ever you choose to do!

There's no way my family is gonna accept it if I date a guy so they mustn't know. And even my gay friends have relatively low opinions of bisexuals, let alone my heterosexual friends, which makes things even harder. I told them about my past heterosexual relationships right away, but if I ever date a guy, I may still keep it a secret until my relationship is stable before I tell them.

[sodorukim]

Just give it a try, no matter what anybody says! It's always best to learn from experience IMO. Not that I've learned very much from it though.:rolleyes:
In MY experience of dating gay blokes, there is a big culture gap and am on a different wavelength to theirs.
When the persecution dies down and they realise that you are actually bisexual, things can go to drama or to apathy making that different wavelength way too emphasised. That happens around the 4 week mark usually.lol
That is MY experience though, and it won't necessarily be yours.....hopefully. The 'right man' is the crux of it and not ALL gay men are the 'wrong man'.:)

Bottoming just to please a partner is NOT a good idea! As a top, I set that record straight from the outset. If your'e not sexually compatible, that's just tough luck!
But I don't know why you think that masculine men would want to top you instead of bottoming. Masculinity is no indicator of that preference, so you may be in luck.

Give it a go! Good luck.:)

I consider myself an experimentalist but when it comes to a choice between friendship and romance, I lean more towards the former for guys. Maybe I need to be more open-minded in that sense. I certainly don't hope it to be 4 weeks lol.

It's probably because of the kinds of friends I have. Tops rarely bottom and bottoms rarely top and they fit into the masculinity and femininity stereotypes. But I'm not the type who would try to be in a relationship. Either I want to be together with someone or I don't think about them romantically altogether. My friends ask me to be more experimental but I'm not sure if I can ever do that. Guess I need loads of luck :P

[sodorukim]

Not every person is interested in full-on anal sex, there are other things you can do that are also pleasurable. Whether you are dominate or submissive may be another matter. Then again who really has the power in oral sex? Is it the man who is receiving or the man who is giving? Who has the power in frottage? I find that I often start out submissive and as I become more or less aroused by certain situations (and the needs of my partner) things change..it can be fun not quite knowing who is "in charge" .. A person can still be discreet and managouous if they desire to do so.. Hiding such an integral part of who you are is not always pleasant, but it is possible.

Guess I need to see if I can get someone to practise things with, but from what I've watched heterosexual sex is quite different from gay sex (and men do look like they know how to please men more). I did try anal sex with a girl once but she felt nothing but pain so we didn't do it anymore. But I agree that as we get closer and try more the inner self will pop out.

[sodorukim]

the initial statements from your gay friends seem to be along the line that bisexuals have a choice to be gay or straight. Something is wrong with that attitude, and it seems prevelent with both the monosexual camps. It goes with bi's don't exist. Needless to say to those here, we do, and as such, you will likely find more happiness in being with other bisexuals over gay men and straight women (assuming you are being honest with them about other partners).

The other half if this is more to do with your personal limits. If you are looking for oral only play with a BF, then you need to be up front with that. I see a lit of ads that say oral only, and some that are all about other non-anal activities. It is a negotiation. Yes, you may end up not having a terrific guy as a sexual partner because his limits are further down the list than yours, and he feels he need to have that activity, but you can still make new close friends along the way. What ever your interest, there is someone else out there that will match it, just be upfront. And if you do find a guy that just limits the same things, consider maintaining that along with some poly options for the female desires. Upfront, honest discussions will make a huge difference.

Al

That's exactly what I've encountered. The gays and lesbians think people use being bisexual as a transition from straight to gay, which is what some people did, while the heterosexuals call bisexuals dirty and slutty just because we are attracted to both sexes. It makes it hard for me to tell them directly that I'm bi, and I can't imagine what will happen to my relationships in the future if I ever tell my heterosexual or homosexual partner that I'm bi.

I don't think I've dated anyone as honest as I wished them to be, when my last three relationships involving the other men. I wish I would be that lucky to find someone who I can talk with about what you said

[dafydd]

Just give it a try, no matter what anybody says! It's always best to learn from experience IMO. Not that I've learned very much from it though.:rolleyes:
In MY experience of dating gay blokes, there is a big culture gap and am on a different wavelength to theirs.
When the persecution dies down and they realise that you are actually bisexual, things can go to drama or to apathy making that different wavelength way too emphasised. That happens around the 4 week mark usually.lol
That is MY experience though, and it won't necessarily be yours.....hopefully. The 'right man' is the crux of it and not ALL gay men are the 'wrong man'.:)

Bottoming just to please a partner is NOT a good idea! As a top, I set that record straight from the outset. If your'e not sexually compatible, that's just tough luck!
But I don't know why you think that masculine men would want to top you instead of bottoming. Masculinity is no indicator of that preference, so you may be in luck.

Give it a go! Good luck.:)

clearly you're dating the wrong men. I don't think you're being bisexual has anything to do with being on a different wavelength to the gay men you date. I just think you're on a different wavelength. U should try dating gay men who are on your wavelength.

[dafydd]

I consider myself an experimentalist but when it comes to a choice between friendship and romance, I lean more towards the former for guys. Maybe I need to be more open-minded in that sense. I certainly don't hope it to be 4 weeks lol.

It's probably because of the kinds of friends I have. Tops rarely bottom and bottoms rarely top and they fit into the masculinity and femininity stereotypes. But I'm not the type who would try to be in a relationship. Either I want to be together with someone or I don't think about them romantically altogether. My friends ask me to be more experimental but I'm not sure if I can ever do that. Guess I need loads of luck :P

It's can all be performative. Tops might top to keep up an appearance of masculinity out of insecurity. Masculine men might keep up an appearance of being a top out of fear of being found out to be a bottom. What I'm saying is, just because you know a masculine man who tops doesn't mean that a) he's really masculine and b) he's really a top... and vice versa with 'feminine bottoms'.

Sometimes u have to fake a certain sensibility just to get the one u desire into bed. "Oh u only top? Sure I'm a bottom" or "oh you only bottom? Sure I'm a top" or "You like masculine guys huh? Well people say I'm masculine. I don't really think about it though" or "you like feminine guys huh? Well people say I'm feminine. I don't really think about it though"... And this can all be said by the same person in the hunt for the one they want.
Point is, sexual roles and there application can be like make-up for men. They put it on, to get laid. :)

sex and dating is such a a performance these days... People acting roles to make themselves look more desirable. People fitting into roles to feel more desire. I think the only way to cut through that bullshit and really know someone is to have a relationship with them.

[zigzig]

My situation is similar. I'm married to a straight guy and want to find a girlfriend. Husband & I are open about this, and I'm trying to meet up girls in chats. I had chatted with few girls, but many don't want to accept that I'm either married, bi or just in an open relationship.

My family is is conservative as your one. I never told any of my relatives about my bisexuality, because they wouldn't accept it.

I can can advise you to be patient and will find the right partner for you. Better a bisexual one as you.

[Realist]

I agree with zigzig, the best relationships for me have usually been with bisexual men and women. My present Gf is fantastic....after over 5 years, we've yet to have our first argument. It's like she's my female counter part.......she's not jealous, or confused, about her sexuality, or mine. She accepts my idiosyncrasies, differences, and quirks, while understanding that we both have desires for same-gender relationships.

I've also had LTRs with 3 gay males; two of them were interesting, but stressful....there was a lot of drama! It's been my experience that some gay males are more uptight, jealous, and bitchy, than the most menopausal, PMS-inflicted, woman!

No relationship is perfect, but as far as I'm concerned, bisexual mates for bisexual folks have worked best for me.

[tenni]

It's can all be performative. Tops might top to keep up an appearance of masculinity out of insecurity. Masculine men might keep up an appearance of being a top out of fear of being found out to be a bottom. What I'm saying is, just because you know a masculine man who tops doesn't mean that a) he's really masculine and b) he's really a top... and vice versa with 'feminine bottoms'.

Sometimes u have to fake a certain sensibility just to get the one u desire into bed. "Oh u only top? Sure I'm a bottom" or "oh you only bottom? Sure I'm a top" or "You like masculine guys huh? Well people say I'm masculine. I don't really think about it though" or "you like feminine guys huh? Well people say I'm feminine. I don't really think about it though"... And this can all be said by the same person in the hunt for the one they want.
Point is, sexual roles and there application can be like make-up for men. They put it on, to get laid. :)

sex and dating is such a a performance these days... People acting roles to make themselves look more desirable. People fitting into roles to feel more desire. I think the only way to cut through that bullshit and really know someone is to have a relationship with them.

In Daf’s scenario, the issue of masculine, top/bottom are linked. What he did not factor in are bisexual men who are not interested in anal penetration either way with another man. There is a group(use to be a large group) of bisexual men who did not fit the top/bottom question. I’m one of them. I do however, see being a bottom as traditionally a submissive role even though some argue that there are such things as power bottoms etc. For some bisexual men it doesn’t matter because we don’t do that with men.

I do see my sexualty as bisexual compared to monosexual...not compared to gay or heterosexual.

Whether to “date” gay men is a question for each bisexual man. Generally, I prefer bisexual men over gay men but I am a bit more open than I use to be. Our fluid attraction changes over time and that includes an entire lifetime (my perspective). The attaction is not based on whose butt will be penetrated either. I find biguys able to empathize clearer with other biguys. I’m more comfortable with another biman than a gay man. No problem with gay men as friends (non sexual, non relationship) though.

I can see sex options/preferences playing a greater role in m2m relationships than m2f relationships. We are socialized to factor in a lot more than sex if we are in a m2f relationship. Overtime, the sex may go away in both relationships. I don't know but wonder if m2f relationship have a better chance of surviving than m2m relationship? Men place a greater role on sexual compatability regardless of the gender of their partner but once in the relationship factor in other aspects.

[cuttin2dachase]

Some good points have been made here. I too am a bisexual man who has no desire or interest in anal sex, topping or bottoming. I have told my past and present and potential male lovers upfront that I reserve intercourse for women, but that I enjoy kissing, passion and almost everything else two men can do in bed. I don't want to meet men who don't enjoy kissing, touching, passion and oral sex. Men who primarily enjoy anal sex don't want to meet me either and I accept that. Most men I've been with happily accepted my limits and we met multiple times. If they wished, I was happy to do them anally with their toys as we played. Others were one time hookups who coaxed or outright pressured me to fuck them or let them fuck me. I did not feel rejected in the least if they did not want another meeting, because I didn't either LOL. It's all about romance and mm chemistry and mutual oral cock worship for me. Almost every gay man I've met was very hurt and critical that I did not desire him anally and that is why I prefer bi men, preferably married and drama free. Gay men also tried to convince me that I should choose between men and women and stick with one over the other.

[Gearbox]

clearly you're dating the wrong men. I don't think you're being bisexual has anything to do with being on a different wavelength to the gay men you date. I just think you're on a different wavelength. U should try dating gay men who are on your wavelength.
I'm closer to the wavelength of gay blokes who aren't so militant about bi's.lol But you are right, I do date the wrong types anyway.:oh:

[dafydd]

I know a lot of bisexual men who *are* interested in anal penetration. I also *know* a lot of gay men who aren't. Someone's sexuality doesn't dictate what they do in bed, only really who they do it with.


In Daf’s scenario, the issue of masculine, top/bottom are linked. What he did not factor in are bisexual men who are not interested in anal penetration either way with another man. There is a group(use to be a large group) of bisexual men who did not fit the top/bottom question. I’m one of them. I do however, see being a bottom as traditionally a submissive role even though some argue that there are such things as power bottoms etc. For some bisexual men it doesn’t matter because we don’t do that with men.

I do see my sexualty as bisexual compared to monosexual...not compared to gay or heterosexual.

Whether to “date” gay men is a question for each bisexual man. Generally, I prefer bisexual men over gay men but I am a bit more open than I use to be. Our fluid attraction changes over time and that includes an entire lifetime (my perspective). The attaction is not based on whose butt will be penetrated either. I find biguys able to empathize clearer with other biguys. I’m more comfortable with another biman than a gay man. No problem with gay men as friends (non sexual, non relationship) though.

I can see sex options/preferences playing a greater role in m2m relationships than m2f relationships. We are socialized to factor in a lot more than sex if we are in a m2f relationship. Overtime, the sex may go away in both relationships. I don't know but wonder if m2f relationship have a better chance of surviving than m2m relationship? Men place a greater role on sexual compatability regardless of the gender of their partner but once in the relationship factor in other aspects.

[dafydd]

Its a shame that the gay men you know are trying to convince you to choose men. They sound like idiots. Just like the straight men you may know who convince you to choose women. There are many people out there gay or straight who will not see your sexuality as their business, I hope you get to meet them.
It makes sense that the married men you meet are drama free. Discretion is the order of the day. Perhaps the gay men you meet aren't so controlled by a closeted situation and therefore have higher expectations of sex with some attachment which may translate into 'drama'. There are plenty of gay men who are drama free, just as much as there are plenty of bisexual
men who don't cheat on their wives.


Some good points have been made here. I too am a bisexual man who has no desire or interest in anal sex, topping or bottoming. I have told my past and present and potential male lovers upfront that I reserve intercourse for women, but that I enjoy kissing, passion and almost everything else two men can do in bed. I don't want to meet men who don't enjoy kissing, touching, passion and oral sex. Men who primarily enjoy anal sex don't want to meet me either and I accept that. Most men I've been with happily accepted my limits and we met multiple times. If they wished, I was happy to do them anally with their toys as we played. Others were one time hookups who coaxed or outright pressured me to fuck them or let them fuck me. I did not feel rejected in the least if they did not want another meeting, because I didn't either LOL. It's all about romance and mm chemistry and mutual oral cock worship for me. Almost every gay man I've met was very hurt and critical that I did not desire him anally and that is why I prefer bi men, preferably married and drama free. Gay men also tried to convince me that I should choose between men and women and stick with one over the other.

[dafydd]

I'm closer to the wavelength of gay blokes who aren't so militant about bi's.lol But you are right, I do date the wrong types anyway.:oh:

as I am to bi's who aren't so militant about gay blokes.

[Gearbox]

as I am to bi's who aren't so militant about gay blokes.
How many bi's do you know who denies homosexuality to gays? Is there such a thing as homo-erasure?:tongue:

[dafydd]

How many bi's do you know who denies homosexuality to gays? Is there such a thing as homo-erasure?:tongue:

Are you kidding me?! U must be kidding me. Or are you buying into to the popularist vote. Or are you kidding me?

lots of bisexuals who aren't out and ashamed of it cause bi and homo erasure as u call it, whether they mean to or not.
LGBT invisibility is everyone's issue not just bisexuals and not just gays.
the men you are meeting are idiots if they deny ur bisexual side. That's not because they are gay. It's because they are idiots.
Try having tea with someone else.

[Gearbox]

Are you kidding me?! U must be kidding me. Or are you buying into to the popularist vote. Or are you kidding me?

lots of bisexuals who aren't out and ashamed of it cause bi and homo erasure as u call it, whether they mean to or not.
LGBT invisibility is everyone's issue not just bisexuals and not just gays.
the men you are meeting are idiots if they deny ur bisexual side. That's not because they are gay. It's because they are idiots.
Try having tea with someone else.
Sweet thing, the closeted deny that they are gay/bi.....not that gay & bi exists. We don't need to see Eskimo's shopping in Tesco's to understand that they exist.....and they are not to blame for any disbelief in their existence by not shopping in Tesco's for all to see either. We've got Wikipedia for that.:tongue:

I recently spent the best part of a month explaining to one lovely gay bloke that bisexuality isn't (or shouldn't be) an issue. That I do exist, I know my own mind, homosexuality doesn't scare me, I'm not in denial yada yada yada that the existence of females is not a threat, I'm not a 'prison hetero'.....lol.....don't need a bit of both, don't care what gender he is, yada yada yada yada ....it WILL stretch if it's used regularly...lol...yada yada....yada

I don't have tea with him any more.:rolleyes:

[tenni]

"LGBT invisibility is everyone's issue not just bisexuals and not just gays."

Oh…now in Daf's mind there is a LGBT Invisibility?

I thought that Bi Invisibility was the erasure of bisexuality in history and institutions such as the media and that includes the LGBT organizations who do not provide services for the specialized needs of bisexuals?

It is now such a strong erasure that Bi Invisibity has become LGBT Invisibility in some Brit's mind? Nope..bisexuals are no different than the gays..they are not even entitled to a "special" discrimination by the gays and other monosexuals…doesn't exist..erased..there now All is better It LGBT Invisibility and not Bi Invisibility...:banghead: lol

[dafydd]

"LGBT invisibility is everyone's issue not just bisexuals and not just gays."

Oh…now in Daf's mind there is a LGBT Invisibility?

I thought that Bi Invisibility was the erasure of bisexuality in history and institutions such as the media and that includes the LGBT organizations who do not provide services for the specialized needs of bisexuals?

It is now such a strong erasure that Bi Invisibity has become LGBT Invisibility in some Brit's mind? Nope..bisexuals are no different than the gays..they are not even entitled to a "special" discrimination by the gays and other monosexuals…doesn't exist..erased..there now All is better It LGBT Invisibility and not Bi Invisibility...:banghead: lol

I used the term LGBT invisibility because lesbians, gay me, bisexuals AND trans people all have suffered and still do from invisibility in heterosexist cultures, where people are assumed to be straight unless proven otherwise. History erases LGBT contributions to culture when people assume that all famous people past and present were straight, for example. This doesn't dumb down bi invisibility or seek to make it any less of an issue, rather it encompasses it and draws links to biphobia and homophobia as a common cause of bi visibility. I could have written lesbian invisibility, gay invisibility, bi invisibility, trans invisibility and meant the same thing.

[dafydd]

Sweet thing, the closeted deny that they are gay/bi.....not that gay & bi exists. We don't need to see Eskimo's shopping in Tesco's to understand that they exist.....and they are not to blame for any disbelief in their existence by not shopping in Tesco's for all to see either. We've got Wikipedia for that.:tongue:

I recently spent the best part of a month explaining to one lovely gay bloke that bisexuality isn't (or shouldn't be) an issue. That I do exist, I know my own mind, homosexuality doesn't scare me, I'm not in denial yada yada yada that the existence of females is not a threat, I'm not a 'prison hetero'.....lol.....don't need a bit of both, don't care what gender he is, yada yada yada yada ....it WILL stretch if it's used regularly...lol...yada yada....yada

I don't have tea with him any more.:rolleyes:

when you first met this bloke you knew he was gay and still met him. now you know this bloke, you know he is an idiot and therefore no longer want to continue meeting him. doesn't this indicate that it is not gay people you have a justified issue with, but idiotic people?
ergo gay men aren't inherently problematic for you, but idiots are. Now that's something I can relate to.

and tea. with you.

[tenni]

I used the term LGBT invisibility because lesbians, gay me, bisexuals AND trans people all have suffered and still do from invisibility in heterosexist cultures, where people are assumed to be straight unless proven otherwise. History erases LGBT contributions to culture when people assume that all famous people past and present were straight, for example. This doesn't dumb down bi invisibility or seek to make it any less of an issue, rather it encompasses it and draws links to biphobia and homophobia as a common cause of bi visibility. I could have written lesbian invisibility, gay invisibility, bi invisibility, trans invisibility and meant the same thing.

I agree with most that you write. The section that is not being addressed is biphobia and bi invisibility from gays. The LGBT organizations did not as a focus fight against bi Invisibility but they did fight about homosexual invisibility imo. Links are not as significant as stating that the gay community has practiced Bi Invisibility and bi erasure.

[Gearbox]

when you first met this bloke you knew he was gay and still met him. now you know this bloke, you know he is an idiot and therefore no longer want to continue meeting him. doesn't this indicate that it is not gay people you have a justified issue with, but idiotic people?
ergo gay men aren't inherently problematic for you, but idiots are. Now that's something I can relate to.

and tea. with you.
Yes I knew he was gay. I didn't deny that he was gay. Didn't expect him to answer 100's of questions to prove he is gay. Didn't accuse him of being a closet hetero/bi/lesbian/asexual yada yada yada. I took him as is, coz it was good enough for me!:)
It is the idiotic sexuality prejudiced I have a problem with. BUT being gay AND being sexuality prejudiced is particularly annoying coz gays of all people know what it's like to be made to feel oppressed for their sexuality. They know that being criticized for being of a sexuality is NOT GOOD! Some still do it though!

I dumped him for other reasons that spin off that mentality. I was the biggest idiot.:tongue:

[CamStar94]

My dream one day is to be with a beautiful bisexual women...

[Annika L]

Then when I talked to my gay friends, they said if I had a choice, I should date girls instead of guys because of their family problems with their sexuality.

That sounds nutty to me. I guess what I don't buy is that you "have a choice". You are going to want to date people you're attracted to. After a while of dating women, you're going to want to date men. You'll find yourself attracted to them, and want to pursue them. Just because it's (supposedly) harder to make a relationship work, you're *not* supposed to do that? You should limit yourself to being straight? No...that sounds like either them trying to deny your sexuality, or them seriously misunderstanding bisexuality.

If something sounds good to you, find a partner with whom you can try it.

[lookn4fun64]

Nicely stated Annika, and all true. It's your life and the clock is ticking. Decide your path, open the door, get in the car, and go.

[cuttin2dachase]

LOL maybe I should not have posted on this thread, since I don't actually date men. Almost every man I've ever met was a playdate hookup for instant sex at his place or mine. On a few occasions, I've arranged to meet men at sports bars or restaurants or other public places, but the understanding was that if we both liked what we saw, we were quickly going to leave for his place or mine and go to bed. I have no desire to date or court men in the same way I would woo, court and date women. That may be the main reason I do enjoy no-strings romance and casual sex with married bi men so much.... because it's free and easy and erotic and sexually fulfilling with no dating hoops to jump through.

[goodtimr]

Personally I think he feels like he is trying to keep one omore cock to suck for himself.