Restaurants and the game "Screw the dealer" aka how much is your food taxed??

[vittoria]

Did you know...

In most places, when you go out to eat, you pay a tax, right?

Usually whatever the sales tax is for the city/state in which you live.

Then you tip your waitress ( PLEASE TIP THEM @ 20-30 %!! the reason will show up later....)

Most of the time, the waitress receives a paycheck, based on hours worked plus how much tips they claim, minus tax....

One would think that is all...

NO THAT IS NOT ALL

Waitresses are taxed ALSO on the food sold. AGAIN.

Thats right, not only is your food tax paid by means of state sales tax, but also the waitress pays an additional tax based on how much food was sold during the time they work ( usually two weeks) so what the restaurant does is total up how much food sales in that period of time, and rack up another 12-15% additional tax we have to pay.

THEREFORE...

If a person has a check thats around 40 bucks, and the patron tips the waitress 10 %, the waitress has to pay 12-15% in tax on that exact check--meaning that said waitress made ZILCH on that table and some money has to come out of her/his earnings..

(in bigger numbers, if a person works 4 days a week, averages 200 dollars in food sales each day, which is 800 dollars in sales, about 85-95 dollars is removed from the paycheck! and in ohio, waitresses only make 3.50 an hour before tips and those tips VARY--imagine getting a table of 10 people, having their check come to 100 bucks, and they tip you 5 dollars after running around, getting infinite refills, getting all of their food, taking other tables, etc etc)

Its a fact.

Just to let anyone know how its important to respect the job of the person bringing you food at restaurants-- we dont smile because we are in good moods all the damn time, its because we are told its that smile and that faux graciousness that brings us bigger tips... unfortunately we have penny pinching knuckleheads that dont (wont, cant, refuse to) see the way fkkn bigger picture of how much money waitresses really dont make.

Food for thought.

[lady_starlight]

While i agree that you should tip high in a resturant - for good service anyways - i have to ask: How can resturants get away with only paying their staff $3.50 an hour? I don't know a lot about American economic policies, but do you not have a standard minimum wage? there are not enough working hours in a week to even make a living at that.

I'm sorry for being off topic...but i find it shocking that people have to work for so little. And having been a waitress before, i know it is hard work.

I don;t think you should always tip 20-30% though. It depends on the service. Obviously if i get bad service, you get a bad tip, and if i get good service, you get a good tip.

[12voltman59]

American restaurants pay that little because the government figures the food servers are going to make up the difference to bring them up to other wages via tips--obviously that is not the case in the info provided by Vittoria--I tend to tip about 20 percent--so I guess even that is really not enough.

[lady_starlight]

American restaurants pay that little because the government figures the food servers are going to make up the difference to bring them up to other wages via tips.

Thats what is generally figured in our minimum wage standards here too, but the rate for a server is only about a dollar less than minimum wage elsewhere. I`m not precisely sure of the figures right now, but i know minimum wage is just under 9$. Maybe our government just assumes we are cheap and won't tip enough so the wage discrepancy is less.

[darkeyes]

Me neva tips... up 2 employer 2 pay propa wages woteva the job is.. no job shud eva rely on tips for a decent wage an long asya keep tippin..wages in the eatin out sector will always b appallin...

[csrakate]

Me neva tips... up 2 employer 2 pay propa wages woteva the job is.. no job shud eva rely on tips for a decent wage an long asya keep tippin..wages in the eatin out sector will always b appallin...

Ohhhh my luffly, luffly tart....don't make me come over there and spank you! I just got back from visiting my youngest and I personally watched him working his ass off as the single server to over 15 active tables of hungry people, all expecting his individual attention, which he gave them.....and you don't tip???? Shame, shame, little girl...didn't Mumsy teach you better??? As a college student trying to live on his own this summer, he relies on the "kindness" of those he serves and he gives his utmost attention and energy to each and every table....don't you think someone like him deserves a bit of a tip???

[FalconAngel]

I remember when I was in High School and my Mom was waiting tables at Pizza Hut. One Sunday she was working and this church group came in after mass. They took her entire area, ran her ragged and the only tip they left was a little card that said "Jesus loves you".

Her manager was so pissed off about it, that he went out to the parking lot, read them the riot act about servers, like my Mom, have families to support or help support, and that their server, that had spent the past hour waiting on them hand and foot, works for very little money and tips and is a mother. He basically guilted them into leaving a proper tip (there was about 25 of them all told) and then he told them that they are no longer welcome at his store if they cannot bother to tip their waitresses.

After they spend all that money on God, then going to a restaurant to eat, you would think that they could each drop a dollar or two for the person who just broke their back waiting on them.

Maybe they forgot that it was people, not God, that gave them a restaurant to eat at on a Sunday. Inconsiderate assholes.

Some people just don't get it.

[darkeyes]

Ohhhh my luffly, luffly tart....don't make me come over there and spank you! I just got back from visiting my youngest and I personally watched him working his ass off as the single server to over 15 active tables of hungry people, all expecting his individual attention, which he gave them.....and you don't tip???? Shame, shame, little girl...didn't Mumsy teach you better??? As a college student trying to live on his own this summer, he relies on the "kindness" of those he serves and he gives his utmost attention and energy to each and every table....don't you think someone like him deserves a bit of a tip???
Mumsy.. spankin me?? ooo sounds fun.... but for fun not cos me thinks tippin is demeanin an patronisin in a sector wer peps r treated like poop, havta struggle long on minimum wage.. fact is woteva our job is...we shud b treated wiv dignity an respect..employers who fail 2 do that simply don deserve the peeps who make ther money for em... the workforce...put upon an ova worked an not treated wiv respect or decency an certainly not paid wot they r worth... if we tip..wen peeps tip..wot we do is by artificially bumpin up peeps wages on a "grace an favour " basis we encourage employers 2 continue 2 underpay an overwork haffa those upon whom they rely for ther lifestyle an ther biz (the otha haff the customers).. so they can "keep down" prices an hav us voluntarily pay a lil more than we othawise wud... by the nasty lil method a tippin...

If we work for the private or public sector we don expect for every job we do a client 2 pay the company for our services an then give us a few quid tip.. (well sum do..but then its called corruption..). No..we demand an expect a decent livin wage.. an in this country at least there r laws an rules wich prevent it for all but the pub, club an munchin out sectors... every human bein shud b paid a livin wage wich affords 'er or him dignity .. tippin encourages bad employers 2 do quite the opposite.. me objection 2 tippin is principled..not cos me is mean.. There r certain places me won eat, clubs me won visit an pubs me won drink in cos me knos ther owners r very bad employers an treat ther workers as scum... an ne employer who pays such crappie wages that they expect tips 2 supplement employees income jus don deserve an certainly won get me custom... an they certainly wudn get me workin for em...

So no Mumsy...don think they deserve a tip..dus think tho they deserve a decent livin wage an treated wiv a lil more respect than they get now......

[vittoria]

And once again.... a hearty "Amen" (in the form of Jerry Lee Lewis' cousin)



I remember when I was in High School and my Mom was waiting tables at Pizza Hut. One Sunday she was working and this church group came in after mass. They took her entire area, ran her ragged and the only tip they left was a little card that said "Jesus loves you".

Her manager was so pissed off about it, that he went out to the parking lot, read them the riot act about servers, like my Mom, have families to support or help support, and that their server, that had spent the past hour waiting on them hand and foot, works for very little money and tips and is a mother. He basically guilted them into leaving a proper tip (there was about 25 of them all told) and then he told them that they are no longer welcome at his store if they cannot bother to tip their waitresses.

After they spend all that money on God, then going to a restaurant to eat, you would think that they could each drop a dollar or two for the person who just broke their back waiting on them.

Maybe they forgot that it was people, not God, that gave them a restaurant to eat at on a Sunday. Inconsiderate assholes.

Some people just don't get it.

And Frannie...


but for fun not cos me thinks tippin is demeanin an patronisin in a sector wer peps r treated like poop---you help treat 'lowly minions' like myself like poop when you dont tip. Just wanted to let you know.

[darkeyes]

And Frannie...

---you help treat 'lowly minions' like myself like poop when you dont tip. Just wanted to let you know.
No V hun.. wen we go out like ne 1 else we pay for a service an expect that those who supply that service r paid a decent livin wage.. tippin wer tippin exists an is allowed helps suppress the propa pay a those very peeps an helps parasitical bosses keep ther costs down insteada payin a propa rate for the job.. do not an neva will consida ne 1 who dus such a job a "lowly minion" for they r human beins every bit as gud as me an who deserve 2 b treated wiv dignity an respect by ther employer an indeed ther customers.. but tippin in my opinion is not a respectable way for a customer 2 behave..far betta 2 pay the propa rate for woteva we eat an drink an hav that increase paid 2 those who hav struggled 2 provide that service an by propa regulation an control ensure the workers in the restaurant, fast food, pub or ne otha such sector r paid decent wages..

Me knows peeps havta eat an put a roof va ther heads.. an peeps like 2 hav enuff self respect that they r earnin ther keep.. but me advice 2 ne who go inta ne sector wich pays shite wages an relies on tips 2 supplement ther livin is don do it.. if no 1 did it scumbag employers wud soon havta get it rite or ther biz wud die.. betta 2 organise an fite for wot is rite ifya can but in the US unions long had a bad name... not quite the same ere tho peeps been tryin it for decades..an quite simply wud nev even contemplate workin in ne sector wich didn allow its employees 2 organise inta trade unions..

So don blame me for the fact that peeps r treated poop... blame the arsehole parasitical employers .. by tippin all that dus is r encourage em 2 keep on screwin yas (metaphorically speakin)..

[vittoria]

Lets try this again...the topic is about how waitresses are taxed for the food sales after the patron has already paid food sales tax here in the UnTIED States--not who tips whom, who doesnt, and why :)

In which case if one chooses not to tip, bully for you, burger king appreciates the business of the non tipper, and if its another country's custom to NOT tip still groovy, just remember the whole "When in Rome" theory...(STILL doesnt make anyones country better than anyone elses... bullshit is made up in other things as we well know, like countless wars, homophobic attitudes, hatred of the Irish and other forms of racism ) especially considering the feudal system, at least ethically, still runs rampant in certain ethnic countries (hint) so it wouldnt be a good basis for comparision ;)

In other news, the local "telly" (mOOOhaha) had a news report on the exact same thing 24 hours ago (gee wonder why THAT topic came up :tong:), especially considering that certain restaurants around here were confiscating a waitresses tips received on a charge card... apparently when a customer pays with a credit card ( here in the UnTIED States), theres a fee that the restaurants have to pay to cash out the credit card, so therefore they lose a percentage of money from a credit card sale rather than a cash sale, ergo, a few restaurants were charging the wait staff the fee.

"Rubbish"? yes. Coming from a plastics technician ( which is my trade for all the class-based, feudal system freaks out there), its complete bullshit.

Knowledge is power. I'm sharing some new found knowledge, not that I have to explain myself, for people do not know what goes on behind the scenes of their favorite eatery here in the UnTIED States. Verily, like with anything on this planet people can always say quite callously, "If you dont like the pay quit", but not everyone has the luxury of quitting and waiting the 4 weeks ( that most of us wait here ) after starting a new job to get a paycheck--people do what they have to do to survive--at least here in the UnTIED States--where this topic is primarily directed. People need to be respected no matter what their job is, by, not only the company they work for, but they need to be respected by the people that come to them and expect a service.

And if one chooses to say a hearty "no, we shall not respect you in the manner in which your custom dictates", then theres the measure or gauge of that individual. :)

[darkeyes]

*Butts outa thread suitably well spanked by V*:(

*blows kissie as peace offrin* MUUUUUUUUAH!

[Bluebiyou]

Picking jaw up off floor...

Waitresses pay 15% food tax?

Or does the government require restaurant to ASSUME the waitress gets 15% tip and taxes her on that ASSUMED additional income?
I remember, back in the '70's the waitress's tips were still unreported income.

[vittoria]

Picking jaw up off floor...

Waitresses pay 15% food tax?

Or does the government require restaurant to ASSUME the waitress gets 15% tip and taxes her on that ASSUMED additional income?
I remember, back in the '70's the waitress's tips were still unreported income.


I shall quote the first paragraph:


Most of the time, the waitress receives a paycheck, based on hours worked plus how much tips they claim, minus tax...., therefore, yes, they get a pay check based also on how much tips they claim -- for example, if the company pays for 42 hours of work for 2 weeks 147.28, and the wait staff claims 183.06 cash in hand , on the pay check, they will be taxed for 330.34, Fed, FICA, medicare, state, and local taxes plus the food sales... technically wait staff have to fill out a separate form for their tips at the end of the year thanks to the Fed, which itemizes (sp) their tips versus food sales believe it or not.


Waitresses have to report their tips. The Fed says that wait staff must report 100% of their tips, but the minimum that the restaurants require is 15%. If the wait staff doesnt report their tips, one of two things happen ( sometimes both): 1) have to owe the Fed at the end of the year, sometimes hundreds of dollars 2) the person who doesnt claim their tips gets audited... and we all know how much everyone loves to be audited...

But that's not the issue.. its the fact that even though wait staff pay the 'normal' taxes on the paycheck, they ALSO pay taxes on FOOD SALES ( an ADDITIONAL 15%) ... food that has been taxed ALREADY...

The customer of said restaurant pays a tax of anywhere from 5-9 percent, depending on what the taxes are for the county or state in which you live, just for eating or even ordering in the establishment...

The person that gives you the food, namely the waiter, or waitress, pays an ADDITIONAL 15% tax on the food that is sold to you--again. I shall copy and paste the appropriate paragraph from the beginning of this thread...


Thats right, not only is your food tax paid by means of state sales tax, but also the waitress pays an additional tax based on how much food was sold during the time they work ( usually two weeks) so what the restaurant does is total up how much food sales in that period of time, and rack up another 12-15% additional tax we have to pay.

THEREFORE...

If a person has a check thats around 40 bucks, and the patron tips the waitress 10 %, the waitress has to pay 12-15% in tax on that exact check--meaning that said waitress made ZILCH on that table and some money has to come out of her/his earnings..

(in bigger numbers, if a person works 4 days a week, averages 200 dollars in food sales each day, which is 800 dollars in sales, about 85-95 dollars is removed from the paycheck! and in ohio, waitresses only make 3.50 an hour before tips and those tips VARY--imagine getting a table of 10 people, having their check come to 100 bucks, and they tip you 5 dollars after running around, getting infinite refills, getting all of their food, taking other tables, etc etc)

Not only do we have to pay the usual FICA, local, state, Fed tax, wait staff ALSO pays an additional tax on the food sold by the restaurant in the form of individual food sales... even though the customer ALREADY paid the tax. The question is, how is it possible that the wait staff has to pay a tax on something where the obligation of tax has already been fulfilled by the appropriate party... ie the patron of the establishment?

[jamieknyc]

No V hun.. wen we go out like ne 1 else we pay for a service an expect that those who supply that service r paid a decent livin wage.. tippin wer tippin exists an is allowed helps suppress the propa pay a those very peeps an helps parasitical bosses keep ther costs down insteada payin a propa rate for the job.. do not an neva will consida ne 1 who dus such a job a "lowly minion" for they r human beins every bit as gud as me an who deserve 2 b treated wiv dignity an respect by ther employer an indeed ther customers.. but tippin in my opinion is not a respectable way for a customer 2 behave..far betta 2 pay the propa rate for woteva we eat an drink an hav that increase paid 2 those who hav struggled 2 provide that service an by propa regulation an control ensure the workers in the restaurant, fast food, pub or ne otha such sector r paid decent wages..

Me knows peeps havta eat an put a roof va ther heads.. an peeps like 2 hav enuff self respect that they r earnin ther keep.. but me advice 2 ne who go inta ne sector wich pays shite wages an relies on tips 2 supplement ther livin is don do it.. if no 1 did it scumbag employers wud soon havta get it rite or ther biz wud die.. betta 2 organise an fite for wot is rite ifya can but in the US unions long had a bad name... not quite the same ere tho peeps been tryin it for decades..an quite simply wud nev even contemplate workin in ne sector wich didn allow its employees 2 organise inta trade unions..

So don blame me for the fact that peeps r treated poop... blame the arsehole parasitical employers .. by tippin all that dus is r encourage em 2 keep on screwin yas (metaphorically speakin)..

And YOU are going to pay for your fish and chips what it costs the owner to provide union wages with full benefits? When pigs fly you will!

[**Peg**]

http://www.labour.gov.on.ca/english/news/2007/07-63b3.html

[darkeyes]

And YOU are going to pay for your fish and chips what it costs the owner to provide union wages with full benefits? When pigs fly you will!

Actually do hun... chippie owners ere r unda the same constraints as ne otha employer in that respect.. they havta pay at worst minimum wage, an provide holiday entitlements an pay NI contribs for ther employees jus like ne1else, an wer the workforce want it tey havta accept union organisation. They havta adhere 2 the appropriate health an safety an hygeine laws for the benefit of customer an employee alike.. Wile the law is different for P/T workers they still havta pay em the rate for the job as decided by law an they r protected by the same industrial law as ne otha workers with differences cosa ther status.. health care aint catered for cos we hav a National Health Service as ya well kno..

Am not sayin chip shop workforces r organised by unions cos they aint mostly..am sayin that many a the conditions peeps work wiv in these places r fought for an won cosa how an wot unions do in the sector as a whole wer they r organised. Many chippie owners r very poor employers, but not all. Most r pretty decent peeps jus tryin 2 make a livin an provide a service.. an treat the peeps who work for em pretty humanely an decently an act within the law.

[darkeyes]

Jus add this Jamie..wen me buys a car, or a house an many otha things like kitchen appliances.. the price reflects wot workers get in waya pay an benefits as negotiated by trade unions.. similarly if me gets a train or bus or plane fares reflect that.. energy costs an all..ther a difference then tween that an goin 2 chippie or a restaurant?

[Bluebiyou]

...The question is, how is it possible that the wait staff has to pay a tax on something where the obligation of tax has already been fulfilled by the appropriate party... ie the patron of the establishment?

OMG

I had no idea this was going on.
The 12-15% tax robs you of the very tips you get. Not just taxing you on your income, but taxing you your entire tip!
I'm so ignorant.
Is this everywhere in USA?
Is this just a growing scam among restaurants?
This HAS to be illegal.

[hudson9]

OK, I think there is some major confusion here, maybe even by the original reporter...

A number of years ago, the IRS began requiring restaurants to begin reporting estimated tips, and calculating the withholding from individual paychecks based on hourly wages plus estimated tips. The logic being that tips are income, just like the hourly wage portion of the server's income. -- So, withholding would be the appropriate marginal rate times the total of hourly wage for the pay period plus estimated tips for the pay period. Usual custom in the U.S. for restaurant tipping is 15% of the bill (including tax), so this is what is used to calculate the estimated tips. Servers are taxed on their tips at the same rate as on their hourly wage (which is the same rate as the guy pumping gas down the street is taxed on his pay). Servers are NOT taxed the full estimated tip amount of 15%, but the marginal rate times the estimated tips.

Some restaurants undoubtedly treat their servers badly. Not all deduct the credit card company's "discount" (charge taken for processing the transaction) from the server's tip. Personally, I think that's pretty slimy -- "nickle & diming" their employees. However, you can always help your server avoid that by leaving the tip in cash, even if you pay the bill with your credit card.

But as far as being "double taxed" it's a bogus statement. It's no more double taxed than the guy pumping gas. Is he being "double taxed" because his paycheck is being taxed? After all, the gas he pumped was "already taxed..."

Just a note to DarkEyes -- I'm glad you're standing up for all workers right to a fair wage, but you are only helping the oppressing masters by refusing to comply with the long-established custom of tipping waiters. You depriving income and power only to the already impoverished and oppressed servers, depriving them of the little economic resources they need to even be able to try to fight for fair treatment -- organizing, striking, and struggling for rights does not come cheap, and there are still mouths to feed. If you want to strike a blow for freedom and justice against the entrenched oppresive system, leave a tip, and then contribute an additional amount to a union strike fund. One dollar spent that way will make a much bigger contribution to real change than your principled refusal to leave a tip.

[bigirl_inwv]

I don't think servers should have to report their tips at all. :2cents: I know the servers that work at the Applebee's Keith manages only make 2.13 an hour. They're lucky if they get a 40 dollar pay check every week. It's ludicrous in my opinion.

Working in this area definitely doesn't make it any better. People will go out to eat, be generally shitty customers, and then not tip anything. My mother always taught me if you don't have the money to tip well...then you don't have the money to eat out.

People who don't work in restaurants usually don't understand what it's like. But coming from someone who was trying to support TWO people on tips and a 80 dollars every two weeks....it's rough. Now that Keith is managing and we have enough money to get by...if we ever go out to eat I try to tip between 30-40%. I know how hard it is...both the job and living with that kind of pay...so even if they weren't the best server in the world...I don't know what they had going on that day, if there was something bothering them, family issues, etc...they have to make a living just like I do.

[darkeyes]

Just a note to DarkEyes -- I'm glad you're standing up for all workers right to a fair wage, but you are only helping the oppressing masters by refusing to comply with the long-established custom of tipping waiters. You depriving income and power only to the already impoverished and oppressed servers, depriving them of the little economic resources they need to even be able to try to fight for fair treatment -- organizing, striking, and struggling for rights does not come cheap, and there are still mouths to feed. If you want to strike a blow for freedom and justice against the entrenched oppresive system, leave a tip, and then contribute an additional amount to a union strike fund. One dollar spent that way will make a much bigger contribution to real change than your principled refusal to leave a tip.
Hun..in me life hav contributed 2 many battles a workin peeps battlin for betta pay, savin ther jobs, equal rites, trade union recognition, betta workin hours an lotsa otha things wich peeps fite for.. hav given time an/or money 2 nurses, firemen, car workers, civil an otha public servants, cleaners. teachers, street cleaners, school dinna ladies, private sector office workers, shop workers as well as restaurant,cafe workers an fast food workers 2 help 'em in battles wiv ther management. Hav dun an will do gain..can do no less as a human bein an a socialist... so please..no lectures bout how me shud act in defence a workers rites.. u hav ur waya thinkin me mine.. do agree principles r all very well unless ya dus summat practical an all.. hav always striven so 2 do an always will...

[allbimyself]

Hun..in me life hav contributed 2 many battles a workin peeps battlin for betta pay, savin ther jobs, equal rites, trade union recognition, betta workin hours an lotsa otha things wich peeps fite for.. hav given time an/or money 2 nurses, firemen, car workers, civil an otha public servants, cleaners. teachers, street cleaners, school dinna ladies, private sector office workers, shop workers as well as restaurant,cafe workers an fast food workers 2 help 'em in battles wiv ther management. Hav dun an will do gain..can do no less as a human bein an a socialist... so please..no lectures bout how me shud act in defence a workers rites.. u hav ur waya thinkin me mine.. do agree principles r all very well unless ya dus summat practical an all.. hav always striven so 2 do an always will...

He wasn't questioning your devotion, only your logic.

[Cherokee_Mountaincat]

lol Next time you go to McDonalds and eat the food In the resturant, check out your reciept and see the Eat In House tax/fee of 75 cents...lol
Cat

[Bluebiyou]

Vittoria,
this is a scam. It is illegal at some level.
Exactly who is claiming this variable tax?
Federal, state, county, city, IRS?
If you are acting as an agent for this food, then reselling it (from the counter to the table) then you do not have to pay initial tax on it, and it would be proper business to pass this tax on to the dining check.
More likely someone in management/accounting has picked up on some local/state law and misconstrued it.
The food cannot be taxed twice, moreover you cannot be taxed for handling merchandise (at the value of the merchandise).
Start asking questions as to who this tax goes to. State, county, city... Then start making phone calls to the state, county, city to get to the bottom of this.
The restaurant may simply be scamming it's waiting staff, and pocketing this 'tax'.
If there is a local tax (county, city) law, then the law is illegal, but it will stand until challenged and overturned.
Good luck.

[PolyLoveTriad]

I used to be a trucker, I cant remember where it was now, but I got talking with the waitress about jobs, she only made 2.50 an hr... the rest to be made up in tips. you're right, its wrong on so many scales. But its true that that some get paid little of nothing and have to make the rest up to support themselves. Thing is, not everyone is the best waitress, not everyone is the best customer. some waitresses cant be even covering minimum wage while others Im sure are doing quite well.

A side note, most truckers I know give great tips... Ive been in groups of them where the tip was far more generous than needed.

Definition of Tip? To Insure Promptness... originally you tipped before you even ate, upon ordering your food :) not after the meal!

[darkeyes]

S'ok..not gonna go on an on gain bout tippin... jus sayin this.. that ova ere we hav minimum wages rates wich r designed 2..tho don entirely prevent peeps in low paid sectors such as cafe's Restaurants an Pubs from bein unfairly exploited, an 2 ensure that peeps who r in work recieve a livin wage..

The current rates of £5.52ph for all workers 21 and ova.. the 18-21 rate (called the Development Rate) of £4.80 an the arte for 16-18 of £3.40. The rates r 2 b upped in October.. when me readsa summa the rates ya seems 2 get paid ova the pond jus don hav a clue how peeps survive.. cos even on the minimum rates ere peeps struggle 2 make ends meet. Know the US minimum rate is set lower much lower than ours an also kno that (officially at least ) far fewer peeps actually get paid that rate than get paid the minimumm wage in the UK, yet equally am aware that millions r paid at rates much less than UK minimums. Now me knos all 2 well thatya cant compare zactly like for like tween 2 diff countries... ther r variations wich need 2 b taken inta a account such as food an fuel prices, health care an otha things..

Am not unsympathetic in ne way 2 workers havin ther pay upped by waya tippin..hav me own opinions on it an undastand jus wy it is dun.. hav worked in pubs wer tippin wos common but is less so now, as it is in the food sector. Many chains an quite a few stand alone pubs an restuarants discourage an even ban tippin... mosta these places, tho not all by ne means, pay above minimum wage rates as "compensation" for lossa tips. Interestin how 1 a the larger pub chains wich dus this has the summa cheapest drink an food prices ya can get..

It used 2 b so that ifya worked in such places ya wer assumed by the Inland Revenue 2 have received a certain amount n tips an ya pay wos taxed accordingly..dunno if that remains the case.. but 1 a the reasons wy the UK minimum wage rates wer set as high as they are (tho in me own humble opinion no way high enuff) wos 2 provide that livable wage an 2 discourage the need for tips in the food an drink sector.. hasnt worked that way tho don think it is quite as common as once it wos.

The kinda practice wich V an othas goin on bout jus wudn b tolerated ere an wud soon b exposed.. the Revenue ere is a bloody gr8 monster wich don like peeps screwin peeps, not cos peeps r bein screwed, but it don like the thotta not gettin wot it thinks it is due... the VAT rate a 17.5% on pub an restuarant stuff is summat that woe betide ne 1 who tries 2 avoid coffin up... that an otha taxes such as Business Rates an NI costs r built inta prices as they shud b.. in theory similar 2 wot goes on in the US but am beginnin 2 wonda...

An Allbi me luff.. me logic has been questioned more times than me cares 2 rememba... u dun it a few times me seems 2 recall:tong:.. Hudson can jus take is place in the queue like ne 1 else..:bigrin:

[qchamp]

Servers are not taxed on the food sold to the customer by the restaurant. Im not sure who told you that Vitt, but they are dead wrong. Yes, you are supposed to claim 100% of your tips to the IRS. But in reality, most people only claim up to the difference between whatever their actual wage is ( say 3.50 for easy math ) and minimum wage ( say 7 ). So they claim 3.50 an hour by the number of hours worked. Example 3.50 for 6 hrs is $21. Some employers will take that as not reporting enough. So thats when they use the 15% ( most around here will only use 8% ). Thats another reason to not be in the food business. No pay, long hours, hard work. However it is tough out there and you just cant up and leave your job.

Tim

[FerociousFeline]

Having been a waiter for both TGIF's and Shoneys and having been screwed over and over again by the "tip report" I finally stopped waiting tables. The "Tip Report" is a way for local resturant management to totally fuck over those people that they don't care for by claiming that you worked more tables than you actually did. I also became sick and tired of being treated like a homosexual because I waited tables. Add to that the frustration of working THREE times as hard as some of my female coworkers only to see them jiggle some ass and wiggle some tits to get paid 2 to 3 times what I got for giving PURRFECT SERVICE!!!!!

So, I quit that line of work. But the experience has made me a discriminating customer and I don't tip well for bullshit. Those who DO the job are handsomely rewarded by me. I generally tip 35% and sometimes 50% if I sense the person needs it.

Mostly, I try not to eat out much anymore because the food all comes from the microwave, and I can do THAT....at home.


FF

[vittoria]

Aaaaah, the "tip report"... that blissfully P.I.T.A. POS that we deal with... gotta love that... NOT!

The thing is, restaurants come up with a variety of excuses to justify the things they do... things we think are against the law are actually allowed because of wording loopholes...for example, restaurants for some reason are allowed to , if a customer walks out on their food order or refuses to pay, take it out on your tips--as long as the restaurant doesnt have a cashier and makes the waitresses do the cashing out...it has been known to happen, and HAS happened.

These are corporations with millions of dollars invested in lawyers for the explicit usage of "getting away with it".



Having been a waiter for both TGIF's and Shoneys and having been screwed over and over again by the "tip report" I finally stopped waiting tables. The "Tip Report" is a way for local resturant management to totally fuck over those people that they don't care for by claiming that you worked more tables than you actually did. I also became sick and tired of being treated like a homosexual because I waited tables. Add to that the frustration of working THREE times as hard as some of my female coworkers only to see them jiggle some ass and wiggle some tits to get paid 2 to 3 times what I got for giving PURRFECT SERVICE!!!!!

So, I quit that line of work. But the experience has made me a discriminating customer and I don't tip well for bullshit. Those who DO the job are handsomely rewarded by me. I generally tip 35% and sometimes 50% if I sense the person needs it.

Mostly, I try not to eat out much anymore because the food all comes from the microwave, and I can do THAT....at home.


FF

[12voltman59]

A little look inside the mind of a business owner/operator as he reads your posts Vittoria:

Well Vi--you mean you uppitty employees actually think the employer owes you anything? Why you ungrateful tart!!

You damn employees have wwwwwayyyy tooo many rights in America already---like we can't make you live in our company owned hovels (I mean high quality living quarters) that we deduct 60 percent of your wages each paycheck--provide you great food (deduct 25 percent more) and all else that we give to you mindless fools out of our great beneficience!!!

Thanks to those socialist bastards in government--we can't make your kids work in our places from age 5 and up in horrible ---err-I mean the safest of conditions! We have to make things safe and we can't just go and run our operations in the most economical means possible (paying decent wages more or less--and having to God forbid--consider the environment and not poisoning everything within a hundred miles down wind or downstream of our factories) Those freaking commies in government made things way too expensive to do business and they try to tell us what to do at every turn--
Thank God for China!!!! Now those red bastards--I mean, those wise capitalists know how to run a business--that businesses are all about making a profit only and all other considerations being damned!

In many cases we provide sick days and damn---you bastards want at least two weeks a year for VACATION!!! And---And!!!! you only want to work around 40 hours per week and we usually have to pay overtime in some fashion if you work more than that, but since you Vi work in a restaurant--we don't usually give you anywhere near 40 hours since that would make you a full time employee and we would have to provide you our most generous health care plan (that even though its the shittiest--I mean--the best plan we could find--it costs us more than we care afford to spend since it cuts so much into profits and the premiums are so high for the few full time employees we do have can afford in most cases,they generally opt out of the plan anyhow--a freely arrived at and wise economic decision based upon how little we pay even our managers--top pay and the really good health care benefits only being reserved for the handful of us who run this company!!)


Good--let the government pick up the tab for their health care by going to the county hospital's emergency room when they are almost dead anyway!! (but not socialized medicine God knows!!)

You should have to work 20 hours per day, seven days a week, 365 days a year until you drop dead of something--at work of course--but then we will bill your worthless, shiftless family for having to stop production, removing your body and doing away with it!!

Shittttt!!!

You fucking ungrateful bastards!!!!

Don't you know the business owners make big investments in their businesses and that provides you PEOPLE a place to work? Of which you should be damn thankful for all of that since hard ass work is such a great thing!!!

Hard work builds character don't cha know??

It should actually be that the employees have to pay for the glorious right to work-- but its all about the business owner--if you are too stupid or unlucky enough to not be either be born rich and or to become an entreprenuer in America, the golden land of opportunity---then shame on you!!!! You are a lazy, worthless slacker!!! Anyone (well nearly anyone) can become rich in America!

Shut your ass up and stop bitching and get back to work!!! Be happy you have a place to come work!!

Just a little fly on the wall moment!!



"St. Peter when it's my time to go--don't cha know that I can't go--I owe my soul to the company store!!"


:bigrin::bigrin::bigrin::bigrin::bigrin::bigrin:

[orpheus_lost]

Just to clarify things if I can:

Vittoria, I think what you're trying to say is that the government taxes the hourly wages of waitstaff and then taxes the "expected" tips of waitstaff based on a formula of the total cost of the food they serve. They're not taxed twice on their tips, but they are taxed on tips whether they actually receive them or not. Please correct me if I'm wrong on this.

While I don't think waitstaffs are being taxed twice, I do think taxing tips is a disgusting way to push the tax burden onto the working class. This tax increase on wait staff was part of a package pushed by Senate Majority Leader, Bob Dole (R-KS), that provided more tax cuts to the wealthy. It was signed by Ronald Reagan in 1986. This law had the effect of immediately cutting the pay of all tip receiving working class people by nearly 15% as it did not do anything to raise the wages of these people who are currently exempted from federal minimum wage laws.

Personally, I think Darkeyes has it right. In many countries the waitstaff is paid a livable wage and does not rely on tips to make ends meet. In my opinion, tipping has the psychological effect of making one person feel superior to another. That said, I do make sure to tip at least 20% if the service is anything above downright rude. In the U.S. if we don't tip, that server goes without pay. Their employer certainly isn't going to make it up for them.

[bihornyoffice]

I believe orpheus is the only poster here that has a handle on this issue. A business that employs more than ten tipped employees is required to "allocate" 8% of each tipped employee's sales as tips, whether actually collected or not. Then, to the extent "allocated tips" exceed the actual amount of tips reported, the employee is taxed on this extra amount for FICA, Medicare and income tax withholding.

There also needs to be pointed out that, although the U.S. Department of Labor rarely enforces it, the minimum wage for tipped employees is $2.13. However, the employer is required to make up any difference where the employee's tips plus hourly wage do not meet the current minimum wage of $6.55. Servers, check your paychecks and raise the issue with your employer. There are Dept of Labor auditors ready and willing to audit restaurants for compliance with this provision as long as enough people speak up.

[arana]

I believe orpheus is the only poster here that has a handle on this issue. A business that employs more than ten tipped employees is required to "allocate" 8% of each tipped employee's sales as tips, whether actually collected or not. Then, to the extent "allocated tips" exceed the actual amount of tips reported, the employee is taxed on this extra amount for FICA, Medicare and income tax withholding.

There also needs to be pointed out that, although the U.S. Department of Labor rarely enforces it, the minimum wage for tipped employees is $2.13. However, the employer is required to make up any difference where the employee's tips plus hourly wage do not meet the current minimum wage of $6.55. Servers, check your paychecks and raise the issue with your employer. There are Dept of Labor auditors ready and willing to audit restaurants for compliance with this provision as long as enough people speak up.
Min wage is only $6.55 in NE?