Is It Hypocritical?

[Herbwoman39]

I was talking to my oldest son today about his opinion on being bisexual. He feels strongly that anyone who is attracted to the same gender qualifies as gay. Even if we're also attracted to other genders, we're still gay because of the same sex attraction.

I found myself yelling "I am NOT gay!!". At which point I stopped, stunned at my reaction. I've been preaching that being LGBT is perfectly normal and being attracted to the same sex is just as natural as being attracted to the opposite sex. So I have to think that denying being gay is kind of hypocritical in a way.

I'd love to get other opinions about this. What do you think?

[TaylorMade]

Listen, if you're a woman and cock (or in my case, Chad Pennington (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m7gQyrCcSBI)) still gets you a little misty in the panties, you're not gay. You're bisexual. You still like men and still have relations with them, so no...

Gay means that even if you look an aesthetically appreciate the opposite sex, if a perfectly good partner of the same sex was available, you'd go to them.

*Taylor*

[biguy3113]

Sure I am bisexual so I guess I am gay, call me what you will but don't judge until you know the real me.....

[SWCube]

I don't think its being hypocritical. A person wants to be called what they are, not something similar. My girl friend is Puerto Rican and hates it when I call her something other than that, even when I'm joking. It may be simulir, but it's not the same. Kind of reminds me of the Choices comic a while back. "So, you're gay?" "No." "Then you're straight?" "NO!" "Asexual?" Kinda always stuck with me for some reason. I dunno. Hope that helps.

[Laken]

The first thing that came to my mind was "Every square is a rectangle, but a rectangle is never a square." Not sure if that makes sense (in this context) to anyone else...but it does to me. haha.

[FalconAngel]

Hypocritical is saying one thing and doing the opposite, so being BI is not hypocritical in the least. But it does open up your options.

Sorry to say, but your son's opinion of what makes someone gay is limited and unrealistic; maybe even Biphobic.

He needs to be educated on the differences and definitions.

[M. Wolfe]

Is it hypocritical? Yes and no. It depends on how you define the terms.

The definition of gay, straight and bi vary from person to person.
Some people may say that
"Bisexuality is neither gay nor straight but the mid point between the extremes."
I disagree. In my mind bisexuality is both gay and straight simultaneously. It's apples and oranges, not something in the middle.

With this thinking, to be bisexual is to be gay but to be gay is not necessarily to be bisexual.

[cand86]

I don't think you were being hypocritical at all. Considering all the sh*t we get from people telling us we don't exist, I like to think that your outburst was not about being uncomfortable with being called gay, but rather anger about once again being erased, marginalized, and made invisible (and who wouldn't be upset about their children telling them that they're essentially big liars?).

There's nothing wrong about wanting someone to respect your identity.

[Cherokee_Mountaincat]

Sweetie, like others have said: If you still like cock, you arent gay. If you like ladies And cock, then you, Miss, are bisexual. But why not be like me and dont let anyone define you? I have a bracelet that was given to me at my first Gay Pride event and its says "Refuse to be defined"
I find this to be great wisdom. To hell with the stereotypes and lables..just be you and dont let anyone elses' views or opinions sway you from Being you. :}
Cat

[coyotedude]

I don't think you're being hypocritical at all. You're not passing judgment on being gay; you're simply saying that you're not. Which is nothing more and nothing less than the truth, yes?

Now, I have heard the term "queer" used as a term for the combination/alliance of non-straight communities as a whole (including bisexuals). But I don't quite know how I feel about that.

Ah hell, all these labels are making my head ache. Call me anything except late for dinner...

Peace

[Realist]

I agree with Cat and Coyote, You are not gay. You have a right to define yourself and you have. No one knows YOU better than YOU!

Whether you lean one way more than the other, or are in the middle, still, you're NOT GAY. As Cat says, if you are sexually drawn to both genders, you're bisexual. 'Nuff said!

[Kermit Jagger]

Herbwoman's angry response to her son got me thinking about how I would react if someone tells me I am gay. Obviously, I am not Herbwoman and am certainly not judging her reaction. I imagine in her situation I'd either let the remark pass or accept it as a complement. If I did get angry, it would be at someone trying to put a label on me. I hate that! I'd be interested to know how other members would react.

Love to all,

Kermit

[Kermit Jagger]

Herbwoman's angry response to her son got me thinking about how I would react if someone tells me I am gay. Obviously, I am not Herbwoman and am certainly not judging her reaction. I imagine in her situation I'd either let the remark pass or accept it as a complement. If I did get angry, it would be at someone trying to put a label on me. I hate that! I'd be interested to know how other members would react.

Love to all,

Kermit

[12voltman59]

Well-everyone has their own definitions of what all the terms we are talking about mean---I have mine as to what bisexuality is that might be different from yours---and since I have been of late only been having sex with guys----you could say I am gay---but I can tell you--that even if I were to wind up having an open and long term relationship with another guy---I am not GAY--because being gay is really about much, much more than simply having sex with someone of the same sex--in this case having sex with other men-----I had never thought of all that before this----but it is really true-----actually--as I see it----the sexual aspect of being "gay" is really about only a few percent of what it does mean to be a "gay" male---

I know that trying to explain that to the "straight" population would most likely be an exercise in futility--but that is the way I see it at this point----

Herby--your son does need some education about things of this nature and to broaden his perspective--he has let the mass culture definitions of these things cloud his thinking----

Good luck though in getting him to think differently about such things--it is hard to get most people to consider definitions other than what is the widely held dictates of "that's the way things are."

[pocomon]

You are neither gay nor hypocritical.

Your son appears to be a labeler however, no more a 'real' labeler than you are a 'real' gay. True labelers are sticklers for definitions and by definition 'gay' is anyone who is attracted to the same sex and only the same sex. Bisexual is the correct label for those among us sexually attracted to both sexes.

The majority of gays would argue all bisexuals are really homosexual but we know that is not the case.

What is interesting about this site is that almost everyone of us are here to explore our 'same' sex side. I believe that is because most of our primary relationships are with members of the opposite sex.

Being either gay or heterosexual would be much easier on one's psyche but, I am what I am.

[rissababynta]

I would have done the same thing. I am married with kids, love my husband dearly (most of the time I guess) and love his cock dearly. Yup...see how gay I am haha.

[littlerayofsunshine]

No I don't think its hypocritical. In all honesty, I don't view myself as "gay" I don't view the sexual things I do as "Gay" I view them as character aspects. I am openminded, caring, loving and a bunch of other marshmellowy words.

Depending on the age of your son. I would just accept his response and respect him for it. Just as you would have him do you. You can just say how you disagree and why. If he is younger, then you have a chance to expand his mind a lil more about it.

My Children don't know about my sexuality. They know about sex, they know about gay, straight, bi, and trans. They have seen gay couples and trans people on television (forgive me if I stated it inappropriately). They know that in reality, whatever someone's preferences are or whom they chose to love, its a beautiful thing that brings a light that helps shadow all the other many negative aspects to life. I want them to view their mother as an open safe haven. They know that if anyone of them were either of the above. I would love them and support them. Yeah I know my children are young, some would say too young to understand or too young to know. But realistically, how many of us knew we were "different" from a young age, but saw all the negativity and decided something must be wrong with us. We hid it from everyone Or how many of us learned later in life, but felt that the ones we love and the children we raised won't understand or accept. I don't want my kids to suffer that. When my kids are older, and they have developed their sexuality as naturally as most people do, I will come out to them and pray that my beliefs rubbed off on them enough that they will still see me as their loving mother. Time will tell.. Sorry if that stepped off topic.

[artsy girl]

I agree with M.wolf on this one. I view myself as both straight and gay. I think it's fully possible to be just a little gay. why not?

When i tell people i definitly say i'm bi...but i have no objection to being called gay as well... and i am married with children as well. I just think... gay,.. lesbian.. transgender..bisexual.. we are all part of the same group in some way.
when my gay friend at work tries to just call me gay.. i do get a little offended.. i remind him that i prefer to be called bisexual..because sometimes i'm having a gay moment .. and sometimes i'm having a straight moment.

Your son is obviously going to have his own opinions especially if he is not bi and doesn't understand it.. but i dont' think there's anything wrong with what he thinks.
I know a lot of people on here have their own opinion on the topic..

It's just my:2cents: Marriedartsygirl

[allbimyself]

Ask your son if, in his view, all bisexuals are also straight in addition to being gay.

To me defining bisexuals as both straight and gay smacks of hypocrisy, not the other way around. Maybe he wants to be able to tell people any of the 3 choices so he fits in with that crowd more easily.

[freechildspeaks]

Sometimes all of us will have to get over the fact that the world isn't going to change, and therefore we should try not to take it personally when someone tries to stick a label on that doesn't fit. Just stay true to who you/we are and forget that the world wants to see blindly through narrowed eyes.

[Annika L]

I was talking to my oldest son today about his opinion on being bisexual. He feels strongly that anyone who is attracted to the same gender qualifies as gay. Even if we're also attracted to other genders, we're still gay because of the same sex attraction.

I found myself yelling "I am NOT gay!!". At which point I stopped, stunned at my reaction. I've been preaching that being LGBT is perfectly normal and being attracted to the same sex is just as natural as being attracted to the opposite sex. So I have to think that denying being gay is kind of hypocritical in a way.

I'd love to get other opinions about this. What do you think?

This is just a matter of semantics. You and I think of "gay" as meaning "Klein Scale 7", completely homosexual. But I hear kids today using the word "gay" to mean anything even vaguely "queer"...frequently, not even referring to sexuality.

It bothers me when I am called gay/lesbian, not because I think there's anything wrong with being gay/lesbian, but because it is an important part of my identity that I am attracted to both men and women, and I don't want people having the wrong impression and making incorrect assumptions about my sexuality. If this is what bothers you about him calling you gay, no, I don't find that hypocritical.

If your son defines "gay" as "anyone beyond Klein scale 1", then ok, by his definition you (and I) are gay. But your son needs to realize that many people define "gay" more restrictively, and so if he uses that word around everyone, people may misunderstand his meaning. You would do well to discuss the Klein scale with him. If he can recognize that using a single word to refer to all levels and variations of bisexuality is not adequate, then he might be more likely to "get" your more restrictive use of the word.

Curious to hear the next chapter in your discussion with him! Good luck!

[Herbwoman39]

My son is 20 and he does have the slanted view of the modern teen. It occurs to me that I *have* tried to talk to him about what he thinks but I've been so sensitive about the issue that we've ended up in yelling matches by the end of the discussion.

Thanks to you all though, I've got some good points to bring up the next time we talk about sexuality. Thanks for the input. It's good to know I'm not a hypocrite. :flag1:

[Lateralus]

I was talking to my oldest son today about his opinion on being bisexual. He feels strongly that anyone who is attracted to the same gender qualifies as gay. Even if we're also attracted to other genders, we're still gay because of the same sex attraction.

I found myself yelling "I am NOT gay!!". At which point I stopped, stunned at my reaction. I've been preaching that being LGBT is perfectly normal and being attracted to the same sex is just as natural as being attracted to the opposite sex. So I have to think that denying being gay is kind of hypocritical in a way.

I'd love to get other opinions about this. What do you think?

It sounds more like you just got frustrated with your son's thick headedness...lol

[12voltman59]

nevermind!! lol

[M. Wolfe]

It bothers me when I am called gay/lesbian, not because I think there's anything wrong with being gay/lesbian, but because it is an important part of my identity that I am attracted to both men and women, and I don't want people having the wrong impression and making incorrect assumptions about my sexuality. If this is what bothers you about him calling you gay, no, I don't find that hypocritical.

This.

I have a mate who will call me gay and I have yelled at him for it. He seems to define it as any guy who is capable of having sex with other guys - making it a blanket term equal to non-heterosexual. This does rather frustrate me as it's not exactly fair. Amongst us guys, we have a game called gay-chicken (like chicken but instead of driving at each other, it's homosexual advances). One time at ma friends place I did make a gay advance in jest (this was after coming out). His face had an expression of fear and amusement at once. He said "It doesn't work if you're gay." Which I found particularly insulting.

[DiamondDog]

No it does not bother me if someone thinks that I'm homosexual, as I do not invest any time into cultivating any identity solely based on a sexual orientation for myself or someone else's comfort.

They’re finding out that there is no such thing as GLBT identity.

It would be like a heterosexual guy saying "I'm straight and this is my identity as a person!!!!!1 In my community we do this and we wear these types of clothes, go here on vacation, buy these things, read these magazines, and in my culture we do this....."

The media and certain political people for various reasons try to keep going the idea that there’s this entire rich GLBT culture that can be compared to cultures communities like you can with communities and cultures for black people, Asians, and Latinos.

Perhaps your son is confusing gay with the term queer? Or he thinks that because bisexuals do have desires for homosexual sex that it makes them partially homosexual? Did you ask him what he means by it?

[jenni77]

I've been attracted to women and men all my life. I can say without reservation I am NOT a lesbian! My bi experience has been, it seems, so completely different to that of a straight or gay/lesbian individual. Moreover, I've found that there are many different experiences of bisexuality and different ways of identifying as bi (or straight or gay/lesbian, for that matter).
Sometimes I wonder if we even need to identify as anything (and I'm not speaking just about sexuality here). In the end, all I want is to feel free to be me--without fear of judgment and without a label being placed on me.

[TaylorMade]

This.

I have a mate who will call me gay and I have yelled at him for it. He seems to define it as any guy who is capable of having sex with other guys - making it a blanket term equal to non-heterosexual. This does rather frustrate me as it's not exactly fair. Amongst us guys, we have a game called gay-chicken (like chicken but instead of driving at each other, it's homosexual advances). One time at ma friends place I did make a gay advance in jest (this was after coming out). His face had an expression of fear and amusement at once. He said "It doesn't work if you're gay." Which I found particularly insulting.

I notice men do this alot more often. Women being bisexual is understandable to a guys mind, but it seems men can't comprehend the concept of a guy who can have sex with another guy, AND turn around and be with a woman. I've tried to ask straight guys this, and they just say. . ."That's just the way it is!"

*Taylor*

[M. Wolfe]

I notice men do this alot more often. Women being bisexual is understandable to a guys mind, but it seems men can't comprehend the concept of a guy who can have sex with another guy, AND turn around and be with a woman. I've tried to ask straight guys this, and they just say. . ."That's just the way it is!"

I've often pondered this and I've concluded that it's merely an egocentric view that guys tend to have. They percieve the female body as attractive and the male body as unattractive and therefore people ought like the female body more - even females. That same perspective makes gays and bisexuals seem equally freakish.

It's a fairly straight forward logic - move towards things you like and things you don't like - and sexually for a straight guy that is towards girls and away from guys. But if their are other guys around that a drawn to you, you ought retreat faster.

And then there is the need to keep your image intact to others, you don't want to be seen by others as one of the "freaks".

[TaylorMade]

I've often pondered this and I've concluded that it's merely an egocentric view that guys tend to have. They percieve the female body as attractive and the male body as unattractive and therefore people ought like the female body more - even females. That same perspective makes gays and bisexuals seem equally freakish.

It's a fairly straight forward logic - move towards things you like and things you don't like - and sexually for a straight guy that is towards girls and away from guys. But if their are other guys around that a drawn to you, you ought retreat faster.

And then there is the need to keep your image intact to others, you don't want to be seen by others as one of the "freaks".

If it's ego centric. . .then how come the perception of the male body as unattractive, which really is a shame.

*Taylor*

[M. Wolfe]

If it's ego centric. . .then how come the perception of the male body as unattractive, which really is a shame.

*Taylor*
Because their brains are wired to only percieve the female body sexually stimulating and not the male, i.e. other males.

That's not to say however that they won't strip in front of a mirror and go "Aww yeah.. yous' a sexy beast." - that's definitely egocentric.

What's interesting is that I've found a study that suggests that a guy who is repressing some degree of homosexual attraction has a 50% chance of becoming homophobic. I'll link ya.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8772014?log$=activity
It doesn't actually say 50% in the abstract but it does on the wikipedia page (which I've lost).

I looked into that because I used to repress hard and was homophobic as well.

[pottzie]

Life is a series of experiences. Sex is a great experience, and shared experiences are more fun.
So share, and the experience will let you know if it was good or not.

Now what was the question again?

[Jackal]

No it does not bother me if someone thinks that I'm homosexual, as I do not invest any time into cultivating any identity solely based on a sexual orientation for myself or someone else's comfort.

They’re finding out that there is no such thing as GLBT identity.

It would be like a heterosexual guy saying "I'm straight and this is my identity as a person!!!!!1 In my community we do this and we wear these types of clothes, go here on vacation, buy these things, read these magazines, and in my culture we do this....."


Oh so well said, GLBT people really do spend too much time being defined by GLBT. I don't think there's no such thing as GLBT identity but I don't think its the only or most important identity.

[bi bi baby]

Not to worry.

It's normal.....if same sex encounters lead to sex, who are we to say it isn't normal.

If it wasn't, why did it go there?

If it feels good, it's right.....................