Bisexual Sexism (sorry, I don't know the proper name for this, or even if one exists)

[RobUK]

Has anyone else experienced this?

As well as all the crap you have to deal with from people who identify as 'straight' and 'gay', I seem to be having to deal with a third form of Biphobia - that from my female bi friends!

Some of them seem to hold the belief that, whilst a woman can choose to be of any sexual persuasion they choose, men are either straight or gay, not bi. This, to me, seems both hypocritical AND sexist! I daren't say to them that I'm bi, in case I get some torrent of abuse from them as well! I just have to listen to their rants and appear not to disagree, without saying anything that could be construed as agreeing with them, and then being used later (if I choose to come 'out' to them) as a reason for calling me a liar!

I know not all bisexual girls believe this - I don't mean to offend anyone by appearing sexist myself. Surely these girls have had to endure some close-minded abuse from other people for being bisexual, so shouldn't they know better not to be close-minded themselves?

If anyone else has experience this problem, how did you deal with it?

[runwildtonight]

It's only happened once. I simply stated that it was a double standard and that seemed to be enough. Usually it's straight folks who I get shit from but I'm finally at a point that I "really" don't care what they think about it as it relates to me.

[Cherokee_Mountaincat]

If they are bi, why cant men?? Seems double standard to me, Sweetie. I cant tell you what to do, especially if you dont want to out yourself to them. Just endure it I guess, or defend your views on it. I know I would.
Good luck Darlin. ;}
Cat

[Bi_Druid]

This is an interesting one, and thinking about it I probably have come across this sort of thing aimed at me, though in a more subtle passive aggressive way.

The whole it's OK for women to be bi, but men are either one or the other, doesn't just happen amongst a selection of bi females, I've noticed it amongst others as well, often amongst the straight communities but also amongst the gay+lesbian ones too.
Trouble is it is one of those things that doesn't rear it's head all that often, or that much, so that it does go unnoticed much of the time. It seems to have become one of those 'unwritten truths' that people have come to accept with out actually thinking about it.

As for dealing with it, personally I've taken the approach of confidently telling whoever asks that I AM a bi male, and if they don't like it then that's their loss. This is probably not the 'best' way of dealing with it (or probably not the best way of explaining what it is I do), but it seems to have worked for me. Take a confident stand on your beliefs. You can't change everyone, as much as we'd like to sometimes.

Perhaps maybe you should take a firmer stand and argue your point with them next time they decide to start sweeping statements of "it's OK for girls to be bi". You certainly seem to already appreciate that sitting back and saying nothing certainly isn't the right thing to do in the long run.
As for the whole "any sexuality they choose", throw in the argument that many gay, lesbian and bi people stand by in that we don't 'choose', we're born that way and that the only choice we have is if to be true to ourselves.

[tenni]

I agree with bidruid to some extent that this issue is the mainstream socially acceptable perspective about men rather than just a bifemale perspective on bimen. It is a mainstream sexist perspective of men generally supported by mainstream (hetero) males. The women are only supporting this mainstream hetero male perspective. One question may be why. I'd guess that it doesn't affect them personally and if they want a man (if they are bi) that they are not comfortable considering men with men and them too? I do doubt that this is a widely held perspective of biwomen though. Are they generally intelligent women or maybe a bit self centred?...lol

These women are supporting the premise that women are not gay if they show physical affection towards other women, they are just being women. Men do not show any form of physical affection towards other men unless they are gay. (that seems to be the base of this stereotype?) The mainstream or hetero male perspective that two women having some form of sexual interaction is kewl and they really may not be gay but two guys...yuck. They're gay for sure even if they touch (unless it is football and you smack another guy (player) on the ass..lol)

[Realist]

Yes, Rob, I've had that experience, too. My first wife was bi and was open and honest about it. But, she had the same opinion that you experienced. She felt that is was NATURAL for ladies to be bisexual, but absolutely PERVERTED for men! Her premise was, girls are pretty, shapely, smell nicer, and look much better naked, so men should not be allowed to be drawn to other men!

Hell, I was so in love with her, I didn't care about her double standards, and married her anyway. To be fair, I never felt that I took second place to anyone and, she never left me feeling needy, either. We were divorced, 5 1/2 years later, but it was over something totally unrelated.

[RobUK]

[QUOTE=tenni;164954
These women are supporting the premise that women are not gay if they show physical affection towards other women, they are just being women. Men do not show any form of physical affection towards other men unless they are gay. (that seems to be the base of this stereotype?) The mainstream or hetero male perspective that two women having some form of sexual interaction is kewl and they really may not be gay but two guys...yuck. They're gay for sure even if they touch (unless it is football and you smack another guy (player) on the ass..lol)[/QUOTE]

Yes, that's another issue!

You often read in lad's magazines (which are normally aimed towards 'straight' men) about a threesome involving two girls (i.e. an FFM) - this is portrayed as very macho 'straight' behaviour - something every 'red-blooded' (i.e. 'straight') guy should desire.

However, a threesome involving two men and one woman (i.e. an mmf) would be seen as (if not bi), gay, and not 'normal'. You often see jokes of women having pillow fights, or comparing breasts. No doubt guys doing something similar would be seen as 'gay'!

What's with all the double standards? I though we'd agreed sexism was something people did in the 50s....

[darkeyes]

Let me start by being honest.. even when I considered myself bi and still dallied with the lesser mortal, the thought of 2 guys having it away ws never something which I found a turn on.. its not that I disapprove or anything like that its just the way I was, and still am.. but I always found touching and luffly 2 guys who kissed in public or walked down the road hand in hand.. I have been to clubs and parties where I have seen guys canoodling and snogging with a pash.. and their hands teasing away at each others bits, and have even witnessed guys with cocks in their mouths.. it neither revolts me or turns me on..I accept it as I was raised to.. as what gay and bisexual men do with each other.. ok... a bit matter of fact but that's how I am..

The double standard is I'm afraid all too common.. and it isnt something we about which we can feel any pride... guys have needs just like us, and whatever their needs are, we should never condemn or pull faces..

In the days I used to get off with guys and take them back to my place, or go to theirs, or even have a quick fuck in a graveyard or in a doorway, it never occurred to me to ask what their sexuality was. I have never knowingly slept with a bisexual man.. yet by the law of averages I must have.. if I had known that a guy who was trying his luck was bisexual.. would I have continued to allow him to chase? Bloody right I would.. if he was sexy enough and I fancied him enough.. several of my friends, one of whom is bisexual..well balanced and not in the least anti gay or bi in almost every other way suffer that double standard and the hypocrisy which goes along with it.. they would no sooner get off with a bi guy than they would fuck George Bush.. and some right set to's we have had about it as well..

Why this should be I don't have the answer for certain.. but the taboo of male homosexuality has always been much more strong than that of the female.. is anal penetration the reason? Possibly..but lots of guys quite happily hump away at their girl friend or wife's arse.. so why the difference?That fact may be a reason why some women, bisexual and straight refuse to take on a bi guy.. they have no intention of being anally fucked.. but its not the whole (no pun intended) answer.. there is just much more reluctance in general society to accept it although even in my lifetime I have noticed improvements in acceptance of it..

Our sexuality is whatever it is.. it's life.. and women who blyuuuugh at bi men, especially bi women, should feel thoroughly ashamed... such prejudice does us no favours and plays into the hands of those who would have us exterminated or at the very least made illegal and forced back into the closet...

[ErosUrge]

(BiDruid) The whole it's OK for women to be bi, but men are either one or the other, doesn't just happen amongst a selection of bi females, I've noticed it amongst others as well, often amongst the straight communities but also amongst the gay+lesbian ones too.

So true. I've only experienced this once and it was with a gay male who just ranted on and on that I was a fence sitter and there was absolutely no such thing as being bi. He claimed that I used my bi-ness as an excuse to not being willing to come to terms about liking sex with men. He insisted that I was using women as a front to hide behind. And no matter what I told him, he would not change his thoughts on it at all.

Interestingly, he still wanted to suck me and being that I was horny simply surrendered to it. When it was over, I still told him that I was bi and that I adored women sexually as much as sex with men and even a bit more.....
He said nothing at this point.

[Long Duck Dong]

the answer to it is very simplistic..... a lot of us know the answer already..... we are just not aware that we know the answer.....so we create them and use excuses like its social conditioning....

the answer is the inability to relate

its like the argument between mc'ds and kfc

some people like mc'ds
some people like kfc
some people like both
and many people can not understand how a person can like both.... ie they can not relate to the idea of enjoying both..... so they justify their opinions....

attractions and feelings towards genders are the same.....
some people like ladies
some people like males
some people like ladies and males
and many people can not relate to how a person can be attracted to both or to the same sex..... so they justify their opinions....

its not wrong, its a part of human nature, yet we judge others based around their inability to relate to our feelings and attractions and opinion..... but we can not relate to their feelings and attractions and opinions either.....

we create terms like hetero / gay / lesbian / bi phobia and sexism, to define how we see peoples reactions.... but often we are not aware that we practice the same judgmental nature.....

not everybody will find some forms of sex, to be a turn on, enjoyable or desirable..... and when we judge people on their enjoyment of forms of sex that we can not relate to..... we never acknowledge the fact that we do the same reaction to things like fletching / eating scat / pissing etc etc.... but to the people that enjoy that, its normal behievour and the idea of bi / les / gay / hetero sex can be repulsive .....

so in simple terms, the issue is simply a inability to relate, and when we judge others for their inability to relate, we ignore the fact that we can do the same thing ourselves, but cos its us doing to it others, we view it as ok

[bemyonlyone]

Admittedly male sexuality has been scientifically proven to be less fluid. That's why I'm chasing after a straight girl but not even bothering with the gay guy I have a crush on. Because I know, no matter what, even if he had the slightest hint of attraction to me, he would always prefer a man and he'd be really unhappy with me. Not that men can't be bisexual, but men tend to be more rigid in their sexuality than women.

And none of us, male or female, choose our orientation.

And I would prefer a bisexual man over any other man...and I don't like anal sex. There is no connection between male bisexuality and anal sex...anal sex can occur between anyone of any sexual orientation, even when there are two women (strapons).

As for why straight guys are bothered by two men having anal sex...I think they're bothered more by the receiving than the giving. And yeah, the fact that doing a guy in the ass is not a fun idea for straight men. It is pretty unbelievable though that a guy will have anal sex with his girlfriend and then call a gay man a fudgepacker.


women who blyuuuugh at bi men, especially bi women

don't know who that would be, I love bisexual men...

[Long Duck Dong]

Admittedly male sexuality has been scientifically proven to be less fluid. That's why I'm chasing after a straight girl but not even bothering with the gay guy I have a crush on. Because I know, no matter what, even if he had the slightest hint of attraction to me, he would always prefer a man and he'd be really unhappy with me. Not that men can't be bisexual, but men tend to be more rigid in their sexuality than women.

And none of us, male or female, choose our orientation.

And I would prefer a bisexual man over any other man...and I don't like anal sex. There is no connection between male bisexuality and anal sex...anal sex can occur between anyone of any sexual orientation, even when there are two women (strapons).

As for why straight guys are bothered by two men having anal sex...I think they're bothered more by the receiving than the giving. And yeah, the fact that doing a guy in the ass is not a fun idea for straight men. It is pretty unbelievable though that a guy will have anal sex with his girlfriend and then call a gay man a fudgepacker.



don't know who that would be, I love bisexual men...


ok scientifically proved, is not true..... sexuality is fuild and so is our opinions.....
any scientific test that tests sexuality is not perfect and based around the responses of the subjects...... therefore the results are open to interpretation..... and if you use kinsey as your proof, I am gonna just roll my eyes and say, * yeah thought so *

even the experts will state that its impossible to test a fuild aspect and give a solid basis of foundation and conclusion


we do not choose our orientation, we choose if we embrace, it or deny it, and if we act on it or not...... hence you have bi guys that will say that they are straight..... so guys are not more rigid in their sexualities, but they can more rigid in their opinions..... and whom they sleep with.... or they can be as free as hell and jump near everything that moves.....
the same applies to both genders, not one.... and that has been proven....

there is a connection between bisexuality and anal sex.... a bisexual male that bears a stronger and more balanced feminine and masculine personality, is more likely to play the male and female roles in sexual contact... than a masculine male who is more likely to only top.... and a feminine male that is more likely to only bottom.....
one aspect of human personality is the two spirit person or a person with clear feminine and masculine traits.... they can be of any sexuality, but clearly show the traits of both genders mentally and emotionally,.... they did not have to be bisexual......

anal sex is a form of sexual expression and desire..... its not sexuality nor gender specific......and anal sex is not something that is found to bother straight males on a wide scale,... studies have found that in most straight males, its the idea of * power sharing and the alpha role *... they want to be the dominant one, the leader... its a predominating trait of the masculine role.....

if you want to check out the porn industry, you will find a number of straight males that have anal sex with other males as part of the job..... they have no attraction to them, its just money making.....
if you use that as a rule of thumb in defining bisexuality.... then the findings that bisexuality is attraction based, becomes nil and void.... and that then makes the nature of bisexuality a totally sex based aspect.....
if that was applied to all sexualities, then people would not make love, they would just fuck...... and concepts like marriage and relationships and romance would not really exist.....

most males can tell you that just cos their cocks are hard, doesn't mean that you mean anything to them and in a lot of cases, its why some people only get laid by drunk males......... and thats not a insult.... its a fact

[citystyleguy]

...from this corner, it blatant sexism, no excuses or explanations needed! to put it simply, i am living proof that their argument is fos! next time they choose to let loose on your pov, just direct them my way!:cool:

[allbimyself]

Let's bring this down to basics.

I don't care if they aren't attracted to men who engage in same gender sex. I don't care if they are turned off by it.

However, the simple thing to say to any woman that says that a man can't be bisexual is "HOW THE FUCK WOULD YOU KNOW?"

Denying the existence of something that they really could not know a thing about is totally absurd on it's face. Just point that out to them. Then explain that the reason they claim that it doesn't exit is that they have a problem with MM sex and they should just admit it.

At that point they can either choose to continue to be bigots against bi men or not, but at least they'll have to face up to the real reason they are if they chose to remain bigots.

[Long Duck Dong]

Let's bring this down to basics.

the simple thing to say to any woman that says that a man can't be bisexual is "HOW THE FUCK WOULD YOU KNOW?"



roflmao, simple and clear.... I love it, allbi.......

[allbimyself]

Ty LDD. It may not be the best way to handle it, but I've found, especially in group discussions, that bluntness in the face of absurdity is a very useful and quick way to stop nonsense.